If the Meadowlands closes, what effect would it have on the industry?

[Harness racer]

I know a little about them, but would like to know more.  Seem to me it is extremely slanted towards these organizations. 

[pocketrocketwinner]

I know a little about them, but would like to know more.  Seem to me it is extremely slanted towards these organizations.

It's my opinion that you are perfectly in your right to want to know more. Believe me or not but they are a very big deal. Lots of people want to silence people like you who would like more information.

[Harness racer]

What I do know seems to be the equivalent of insider trading.  They have knowledge that the general public doesn't.  Seems like a huge advantage and conflict of interests in regards to a level playing field.

[pocketrocketwinner]

What I do know seems to be the equivalent of insider trading.  They have knowledge that the general public doesn't.  Seems like a huge advantage and conflict of interests in regards to a level playing field.

They have a technology advantage. They can analyze all pools and send in an unlimited amount of bets in less than 1 second based on a very sophisticated algorithm or AI.
Personally. I don't think the algo/AI s the problem. You and I could also develop AI to predict outcomes. It's their ability to place bets that is vastly different from any human.

[Harness racer]

Is there a possibility of the rumor that their window closes a little later than the betting public being true?  That and the unlimited last second bets makes me never want to waste my money again.

[pocketrocketwinner]

Is there a possibility of the rumor that their window closes a little later than the betting public being true?  That and the unlimited last second bets makes me never want to waste my money again.

Very lengthy studies have been conducted in the thoroughbred world. The first bets come in as the gate starts to load and then the majority of bets come in after all human bets are placed but before the race actually starts, if that makes sense. They are not betting horses who leave the gate, after the race starts, but they are betting after people like you and I. The negations generally go like this, they approach a track and guarantee a certain amount of monthly handle. In return, they get a negotiated rebate structure and ability to tie their betting programs into the pools which  facilitate their batch bets after all human bets are in the pool. This is why you see wild odds changes at the meadowlands from race - off to final - odds.

[Papillon]

Very lengthy studies have been conducted in the thoroughbred world. The first bets come in as the gate starts to load and then the majority of bets come in after all human bets are placed but before the race actually starts, if that makes sense. They are not betting horses who leave the gate, after the race starts, but they are betting after people like you and I. The negations generally go like this, they approach a track and guarantee a certain amount of monthly handle. In return, they get a negotiated rebate structure and ability to tie their betting programs into the pools which  facilitate their batch bets after all human bets are in the pool. This is why you see wild odds changes at the meadowlands from race - off to final - odds.

this doesn't make any sense

if everyone else can make bets up until the gate leaves--then the CAW analyzes then makes their bets after everyone else--inherently that means the CAW is betting after the race starts

also fact--other entities are allowed to wager after the bell(i.e Lexington, the hub in Oregon, etc)-so Elite bets after they do--so they are betting way after the bell

the reason you see wild odds changing is due to betting after the bell

you don't see breakers suddenly go off 1-9

[pocketrocketwinner]

this doesn't make any sense

if everyone else can make bets up until the gate leaves--then the CAW analyzes then makes their bets after everyone else--inherently that means the CAW is betting after the race starts

also fact--other entities are allowed to wager after the bell(i.e Lexington, the hub in Oregon, etc)-so Elite bets after they do--so they are betting way after the bell

the reason you see wild odds changing is due to betting after the bell

you don't see breakers suddenly go off 1-9

I have no interest in discussing a topic of humans betting horses after the race starts.

For caws. The AI determines the wagers in less than 1 seconds and they are sent in as a batch in less than 1 second. There is a extremely small window when it all takes place, beginning to end. Extremely thorough and lengthy iindependent investigative studies revealed in the thoroughbreds exactly when the CAW bets come in. I believe those findings as fact

[dougie]

My wife and I were at the Meadowlands opening night in 1976. We were 19 years old. The lines were so long, many got closed out of their bet. It was the most beautiful track I ever saw. Many years have passed, and harness racing has declined in that time. But I would be saddened to see the track close. I don't love Jeff Gural. But I think that despite his faults, I hope he keeps the track open.

[Chessington]

My wife and I were at the Meadowlands opening night in 1976. We were 19 years old. The lines were so long, many got closed out of their bet. It was the most beautiful track I ever saw. Many years have passed, and harness racing has declined in that time. But I would be saddened to see the track close. I don't love Jeff Gural. But I think that despite his faults, I hope he keeps the track open.

How about all the excitement the front paddock generated back then? Amazing racing cards 6 nights a week, unbelievable crowds. AC opened a few years later, the rest is history

[wizardofoz]

My wife and I were at the Meadowlands opening night in 1976. We were 19 years old. The lines were so long, many got closed out of their bet. It was the most beautiful track I ever saw. Many years have passed, and harness racing has declined in that time. But I would be saddened to see the track close. I don't love Jeff Gural. But I think that despite his faults, I hope he keeps the track open.

I have the opening night program as well and it was a mob scene that night September 1 1976.

[dougie]

Geez Wiz.....you were smart enough to save it. That is so cool! I wish I saved it!

[Kole Hanover]

Anyone that takes on that complete scum Howard Taylor I'm on board with

 Good point

 Gural didn't cave to Uncle Howie

 +1

[Jazzman]

absolutly none its just a b track now 2nd rate horses and drivers

[Grandstand Handicapper]

I sure there are many of us who were there opening night, and who continued going regularly over the course of the next 20 to 30 years, and longer. While many feel OTB (generically, off-track wagering) was the beginning of the downfall of horseracing in general, the world changes and very many things are impacted by that change. Texas hold 'em/poker has seen a complete revitalization, some say going from an almost near death, to becoming a household familiar sport and form of entertainment. One, and then two states used to have casinos, and now 44 states have some sort of casino. Sports betting, fixed odds, betting from your phone, and more.

You cannot compare anything about the Meadowlands of the 70's and 80's (and maybe into the early 90's) with the Meadowlands of today. Nor can you compare today's Yonkers to the Yonkers of the 60's and 70's.

Gural's posturing---or if you want to call it complaining, whining, whatever, I couldn't care less---doesn't bother me. It's free for him to say it, and free to those who choose to listen. Me, I don't listen. But that doesn't mean I bitch about it or despise him for doing so. When I've had the opportunity to talk to him, I talk to him about issues that impact owners and bettors, people who make a living from this sport and industry. If you are anti-casino outside AC, then that's your position. Pro-casino, but anti-Meadowlands local and/or Gural, good for you. Enjoy. Me, being that I think there will be casinos outside AC, and being I make my living in this, I would like to see a casino at the Meadowlands, and I would like to see Gural get it.

As a bettor, and as a horse owner, I am definitive that I am better off with Gural than any other owner/operator. Better off for me, as a bettor, is large pools to bet into, full and competitive fields, low takeouts, and more regulation and restrictions for rebate shops and CAW's. But that's just me. That and $5 gets me a frou-frou drink at Starbucks. LOL.