If I Had A Vote

[Fuguzzi]

As most of you know by now, when it comes to harness racing, I am essentially a traditionalist and have a great fondness for the glory days and a particular reverence for the HOF.

One of the things that makes our HOF so special to me is that, for the most part, enshrinement is often so subjective, especially more recently. Unlike baseball for example, we do not have automatic benchmarks like 3000 hits or 500 home runs. If we did, every guy that gets to 10,000 wins would get in and we know that's not gonna happen. Otherwise they better start making little figures of billy parker and bruce ranger right now.

So bearing this in mind, I have been reflecting on three recent additions and one future addition to the HOF.  As I've stated before, I have always drawn a parallel to that famous quote about obscenity when it comes to the people considered for enshrinement. "I can't describe it, but I know it when I see it".  The "it" is the "it factor".  George Brennan, for example, who I believe will soon be inducted as many of you agree with, had that "it" factor from almost day one. 

So now we have Billy Popfinger, Chris Boring and Ted Wing all recently inducted and Ed Lohmeyer about to be. 

Billy Popfinger never struck me as a Hall of Famer, was a very mediocre driver, in fact I think his brother, Frank, was better...but he did the Grand Circuit thing, had a few very good horses and he's there.

Chris Boring - fine horseman, handful of good horses - one really super horse -- I just don't get it. They did a nice thing and they needed someone from the midwest before he died.

Ted Wing -- excellent horseman, probably has 4 or 5,000 wins, catch drove for me a little bit -- not sure about the "it" factor.

Ed Lohmeyer -  distinguished career, really good guy, a few monster horses, driving titles out of town, no "it factor", but congrats to him.

Obviously, none of these men are Haughtons, Dancers or Millers - nor should they be.  But if these men's careers are the new benchmark, then I submit a name who has to - after a fine and accomplished 35 year career -- begin to be considered for the HOF.  Ray Schnittker.

Let me address the "it factor" first...definitel y lacking.  Now let's look at the career resume which equals or exceeds the four aforementioned inductees.  Ray, as of now, is at or very near the 3000 win/50 million earned plateaus.  He is one of the few trainers in the era of speed to win a Meadowlands Pace and a Hambletonian  proving skill with both gaits.  His 3000 win total while not flashy by today's standards, is impressive when you consider he wasn't a regular catch driver.  He has trained or developed multiple million dollar earners, including a two million dollar earner and a three million dollar earner. Deweycheatumandho w and One More Laugh alone would define a very good career, but Ray has done much more. Starting with Covert Action, the list of his good and very good horses could fill half a page. He has 3 Dan Patch awards and has driven 3 Dexter Cup victories. He has enjoyed continued success on the sire stake and grand circuit levels as well as served the industry in an official capacity.  If he has had a major drug or gambling scandal attached to his name, I have missed it and I go back with Ray literally to the day he arrived at Yonkers and they put him in the upstairs ship-in barn.

Is Ray opinionated?  Sure.  Aren't we all?  But Ray is a really good guy and excellent horseman.  And as stated, I believe his career resume is certainly worthy of HOF induction. Hopefully, that day will come.

[Gaagoots]

Popfinger & Boring do not belong.  Nice post Fuguzzi!

[Fuguzzi]

Popfinger & Boring do not belong.  Nice post Fuguzzi!

TY, my friend.

[jupiter]

Total reality re: Ray I go back to when he first came around Buffalo with his dad. He is too honest a times. He should be in the HOF. Teddy Wing was a great all around horseman. Billy = Mr Showman, Eddie has always been a class act, good horses, Chris Boring likeable midwesterer had some success but HOF

[kooter for hipin]

TY, my friend.

I think you have a pretty good handle on the days of old when knights were bold. Chris Boring beat both Bret and Cardigan Bay at Hollywood Park with True Duane. I had my parents breed two of our best broodmares to him. One by Airliner and the other by Widower Creed. Both were A-1-JFA. I also had a fancy for Super Wave especially when Kopas turned the driving over to Clint Hodgins. I also had a colt by him with just about the same result. Super Wave was an in credible horse. I do not agree with Schniktter or Bill Popfinger.  Frank is an entirely different story for a different time.  Other than that, I agree that you surely know your shit for whatever my opinion is worth.
 

[Fuguzzi]

I think you have a pretty good handle on the days of old when knights were bold. Chris Boring beat both Bret and Cardigan Bay at Hollywood Park with True Duane. I had my parents breed two of our best broodmares to him. One by Airliner and the other by Widower Creed. Both were A-1-JFA. I also had a fancy for Super Wave especially when Kopas turned the driving over to Clint Hodgins. I also had a colt by him with just about the same result. Super Wave was an in credible horse. I do not agree with Schniktter or Bill Popfinger.  Frank is an entirely different story for a different time.  Other than that, I agree that you surely know your shit for whatever my opinion is worth.
 

Appreciate your words and sentiments. Boring also had ColtFortySix, correct? True Duane was a career maker no doubt.
Interesting you disagree about Schnittker given his current resume as spelled out. Not completely surprised and I don;t mean you personally. I know he has detractors and there is a bias towards him.. Loved Superwave, btw. Kopas's great horseman!

[kooter for hipin]

Appreciate your words and sentiments. Boring also had ColtFortySix, correct? True Duane was a career maker no doubt.
Interesting you disagree about Schnittker given his current resume as spelled out. Not completely surprised and I don;t mean you personally. I know he has detractors and there is a bias towards him.. Loved Superwave, btw. Kopas's great horseman!

.....but not his driving       

[Dingus]

And let’s not forget that Ray claimed Calypso Beat from Bob Bongiorno for $31,250 as a 4 year old, and the horse went on to win almost $1 million for Ray.

[theokodjak26]

As Fug says a lot of the harness HOF is more subjective rather than based some specific achievements like a certain number of winners, earned dollars etc. However the harness version of the Hall is not the only one with questionable inductees. Take baseball which includes racists, bigots and compilers. Compilers being people such as Phil Niekro who garnered 318 wins over 24 seasons but does anyone recall how many, if any, “it moments” he had? I can not even remember one even though he was a 5 time all star. For me Niekro was a questionable inductee. The same goes for harness racing which also may have a touch of politics added. Take Cat Manzi. He had a terrific career but can you really compare him to people like Campbell, O’Donnell, Haughton, Dancer and the like. Which brings me to George Brennan who for my money should have been nominated and elected to the HOF a long time ago. Was Cat a superior driver to Brennan or was he also a compiler? Not taking anything away from Cat but Brennan was every bit as good a driver as Cat in my opinion. Chris Boring is he a superior driver than Brennan? I just don’t see it. And Bill Popfinger how does he even get mentioned compared to Brennan? So my guess is probably in the same boat as say Boston Red Sox Jim Rice. Rice wasn’t a media favorite and it took him forever to get in. Is Brennan having a similar fate because the press or the USTA doesn’t care for him? Maybe a few Ploppers care to express their opinions about the Brennan situation and the HOF in general.

[kooter for hipin]

As Fug says a lot of the harness HOF is more subjective rather than based some specific achievements like a certain number of winners, earned dollars etc. However the harness version of the Hall is not the only one with questionable inductees. Take baseball which includes racists, bigots and compilers. Compilers being people such as Phil Niekro who garnered 318 wins over 24 seasons but does anyone recall how many, if any, “it moments” he had? I can not even remember one even though he was a 5 time all star. For me Niekro was a questionable inductee. The same goes for harness racing which also may have a touch of politics added. Take Cat Manzi. He had a terrific career but can you really compare him to people like Campbell, O’Donnell, Haughton, Dancer and the like. Which brings me to George Brennan who for my money should have been nominated and elected to the HOF a long time ago. Was Cat a superior driver to Brennan or was he also a compiler? Not taking anything away from Cat but Brennan was every bit as good a driver as Cat in my opinion. Chris Boring is he a superior driver than Brennan? I just don’t see it. And Bill Popfinger how does he even get mentioned compared to Brennan? So my guess is probably in the same boat as say Boston Red Sox Jim Rice. Rice wasn’t a media favorite and it took him forever to get in. Is Brennan having a similar fate because the press or the USTA doesn’t care for him? Maybe a few Ploppers care to express their opinions about the Brennan situation and the HOF in general.

Incredibly well presented! 

[Fuguzzi]

And let’s not forget that Ray claimed Calypso Beat from Bob Bongiorno for $31,250 as a 4 year old, and the horse went on to win almost $1 million for Ray.

Yes he did. One of the millionaires in his arsenal.

[Fuguzzi]

As Fug says a lot of the harness HOF is more subjective rather than based some specific achievements like a certain number of winners, earned dollars etc. However the harness version of the Hall is not the only one with questionable inductees. Take baseball which includes racists, bigots and compilers. Compilers being people such as Phil Niekro who garnered 318 wins over 24 seasons but does anyone recall how many, if any, “it moments” he had? I can not even remember one even though he was a 5 time all star. For me Niekro was a questionable inductee. The same goes for harness racing which also may have a touch of politics added. Take Cat Manzi. He had a terrific career but can you really compare him to people like Campbell, O’Donnell, Haughton, Dancer and the like. Which brings me to George Brennan who for my money should have been nominated and elected to the HOF a long time ago. Was Cat a superior driver to Brennan or was he also a compiler? Not taking anything away from Cat but Brennan was every bit as good a driver as Cat in my opinion. Chris Boring is he a superior driver than Brennan? I just don’t see it. And Bill Popfinger how does he even get mentioned compared to Brennan? So my guess is probably in the same boat as say Boston Red Sox Jim Rice. Rice wasn’t a media favorite and it took him forever to get in. Is Brennan having a similar fate because the press or the USTA doesn’t care for him? Maybe a few Ploppers care to express their opinions about the Brennan situation and the HOF in general.

Good points, Kojak and you expanded on some of the premises I was getting into when I set the stage for my support of Ray.
One of the complications when trying to compare drivers is that we have progressed from the world of the trainer/driver to the professional catch driver. Comparing Boring to George Brennan as a driver is naturally lunacy. Now, in defense of boring, could George have trained a True Duane to upset not one, but 2 legendary horses - certainly not! Just using your comparison. Btw, I strongly believe George should be ion the HOF as many agreed with earlier this week, but I do not feel his non election at this point is a crime, the way Tony Morgan not being in yet IS a crime. i believe George Brennan will be elected in the relatively near future and once some of the members get past their Ray Schnittker bias because he is brash and bold and tells it like it is, Ray will have his day too.

[theokodjak26]

Tony Morgan with over 17,000 wins and a career win percentage over 20% not in the HOF? Who has he pissed off all these years?

[Fuguzzi]

Tony Morgan with over 17,000 wins and a career win percentage over 20% not in the HOF? Who has he pissed off all these years?

Bergstein and Pines. Apparently, years, and i mean years ago, he blew off a couple of events that Stan Bergstein was sponsoring ,to do what he does, drive horses. A grudge ensued and the rest is history. Sounds very silly and petty, As for Phil Pines, I knew there was bad blood but I have no idea why.

[Stan durbread]

Bergstein and Pines. Apparently, years, and i mean years ago, he blew off a couple of events that Stan Bergstein was sponsoring ,to do what he does, drive horses. A grudge ensued and the rest is history. Sounds very silly and petty, As for Phil Pines, I knew there was bad blood but I have no idea why.

He obviously never told you to drop a horse in a cheaper claimed. Then claimed it