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General Category => Harness Racing => Topic started by: wizardofoz on November 06, 2023, 07:59:40 PM
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RACE 12 - Dover Downs - DE - November 9, 2023
Conditions: MATRON STAKES 3 Year Old Colts & Geldings Declaration Fee $1,500
Gait: PacePurse: 170,850 Class: MATRON 3CP Distance: 1 Mile Post Time: 8:10 PM
PP Horse Med 2023 North America YTD Driver Trainer ML Claim
Equip Sts W P S Time Earnings Stable Odds Price
1 Fulton
L 14 4 1 2 1:48.2S $255449 Scott Zeron Linda Toscano
2 El Rey
17 3 3 3 1:48.3M $202832 Dexter Dunn
Andrew Harris
3 Hungry Angel Boy
L 15 1 5 4 1:48.2M $305915 Todd McCarthy Tony Alagna
4 Thunder Hunter Joe
12 6 2 2 1:49.2S $317926 Montrell Teague Nicholas Devita
5 Ken Hanover
L 18 8 5 1 1:48.4H $395103 David Miller Roland Mallar
6 Cannibal
L 16 11 2 1 1:48.1M $580730 Yannick Gingras Nancy Takter
7 Confederate
L 13 12 1 0 1:46.1M $1544929 Tim Tetrick Brett Pelling
8 Redwood Hanover
3, Stay Hungry 16 4 2 2 1:49.0S $204123 Dexter Dunn Chris Ryder
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After the recent midnight revelations he is back this Thursday from an outside post.
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Big
7514
7541
Smaller
5714
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Good Luck tmbz1
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I don't really get the purpose of this. If he wins, it's not going to prove anything we don't already know. And if he loses, it will only tarnish his excellent record. Anything can happen in a horse race especially on a smaller track and a bad post position. I say go out a BC winner.
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It's called greed.
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I don't really get the purpose of this. If he wins, it's not going to prove anything we don't already know. And if he loses, it will only tarnish his excellent record. Anything can happen in a horse race especially on a smaller track and a bad post position. I say go out a BC winner.
Your conservative thinking makes sense.
The decision was probably made a while ago.
It takes balls to be a gambler, horseman all a days, good to see DCF and connections lifted up their skirt and produced a set.
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The race hasn't been run yet..Wouldn't be shocked If the seven hole might cause a slight 'COLD OR COUGH'. 'Precautionary' scratch.
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Your conservative thinking makes sense.
The decision was probably made a while ago.
It takes balls to be a gambler, horseman all a days, good to see DCF and connections lifted up their skirt and produced a set.
It's a prep to race against the aged horses, Tattoo Artist, etc., in hopes of victory and padding his announced 20K stud fee. It does come down to money, but I fear they are throwing caution to the wind.
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It's a prep to race against the aged horses, Tattoo Artist, etc., in hopes of victory and padding his announced 20K stud fee. It does come down to money, but I fear they are throwing caution to the wind.
Probable 1/500 odds his book is full for the next 2 years, but like you said starting at 20, and then please call for pricing.
I watched that treacherous wet track and how he wins wrapped up and BP said he's so "willing". An understatement.
Well if he doesn't die on the track *God forbid*, get beamed up by a ufo from the finish line we'll see if he's to pacers as Walner is currently to trotters.
It's all above my pay grade. ngc3
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It's a prep to race against the aged horses, Tattoo Artist, etc., in hopes of victory and padding his announced 20K stud fee. It does come down to money, but I fear they are throwing caution to the wind.
Yes, they tipped that they are strongly considering the FanDuel race (formerly TVG).
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Adam Bowden starting to act a lot more like Ahmed Zayat, (of American Pharaoh Fame). Just another greedy fuck pushing the horse for more money.
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A free $ 85,425 for a trip of the Dover oval. Wins for fun.
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So wait, Diamond Creek are cowards for not going two heats at the Jug but a one off for history going for a quarter of the money is “greedy”. Make up your minds.
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The race hasn't been run yet..Wouldn't be shocked If the seven hole might cause a slight 'COLD OR COUGH'. 'Precautionary' scratch.
post #7 is actually a good spot when your horse will be 1-9
why anyone would think post #7 is a bad draw is mindboggling
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Adam Bowden starting to act a lot more like Ahmed Zayat, (of American Pharaoh Fame). Just another greedy fuck pushing the horse for more money.
Ahmed Zayat was biggest scumbag in T breds. Owed everyone and complete degenerate loser. Not many people know he sold Pharaoh after derby and agreed to get rest of racing money. That's why they raced his guts out.
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This has nothing to do with greed. At least not for purse money, LOL. If you think it does then you don't know and don't understand the business, or the sport for that matter. This exclusively has to do with Bowden not wanting the foals excluded via the Gural. He's had numerous conversations with breeders, met with people during the KY sales, and he's getting the temperature of the market landscape. The breeders and the buyers have spoken. As a result of all this, this is all a plan to prep the horse to race against the older horses.
Racing against older horses, even a very brief 4yo racing career, did it hurt Captaintreacherou s? And somehow they syndicated him for $12mm or so. LOL.
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I'm hoping that one of his competitors will get some help from the Trunk Vet and send a shock thru the Harness universe!💉💉💉💉💉💉💉💉💉 ngc3
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Program page: https://harnessracingupdate.com/pdf/trackmaster/20231109ddx.pdf
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Dovers short stretch and his post makes his racing style beat-able tonight.
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Dovers short stretch and his post makes his racing style beat-able tonight.
He has to leave, tuck and then 1/4 move the horse to the lead by the 1/2 mile pole.
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He has to leave, tuck and then 1/4 move the horse to the lead by the 1/2 mile pole.
Or else?
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Might be too far back with the short stretch if Tetrick waits too long.
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Might be too far back with the short stretch if Tetrick waits too long.
You better call the paddock and remind Tetrick how short the stretch is. He has only won about 20 races in two weeks there
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Or he can just sit outside then brush to front after 1/4. And win for fun
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Kudos to them for taking the risk..I felt like there was more to lose than gain but he is definitely a badass..Having his stablemate getting to the front first didn't hurt.
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Congratulations Timmy glad you were able to win with a short stretch
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Kudos to them for taking the risk..I felt like there was more to lose than gain but he is definitely a badass..Having his stablemate getting to the front first didn't hurt.
Not stable mate Just common owner. Watch the Jug and tell me Yanick and Timmy play nice just because they both drive for DC
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That was then, this is now..Last I looked Confederate didn't race in the Jug.
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Yannick folded Canibal in half , he run DMiller over his back, to turn him loose. If they’re stupid enough to race him in the TVG FFA he will get his nuts clipped.
He gets no curiosity release to the front in that race. He will get his head handed to him
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The Fan Dual is a free swing for him! When they beat him we will hear everything from scoped sick to he didn't like the surface, and every other reason under the sun and moon except the truth!
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Confederate jiggity jogs
he will win the TVG with a late rush. Remember Ruthless Hanover is coming back for this. He and Tattoo will burn themselves out
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He has to leave, tuck and then 1/4 move the horse to the lead by the 1/2 mile pole.
As was a textbook drive to win.
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When and where is the Fan Dual..TVG..race coming up?
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Confederate won't need excuses racing against older horses. Remember, he is not racing against older horses for or to appease the fans. He's doing it for the breeders and yearling buyers. Period. You want to attract top quality mares and sell big money foals -- exclude foals and see what happens.
Same with Captaintreacherou s (who as an aside they even gave an abbreviated 4yo campaign).
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Confederate won't need excuses racing against older horses. Remember, he is not racing against older horses for or to appease the fans. He's doing it for the breeders and yearling buyers. Period. You want to attract top quality mares and sell big money foals -- exclude foals and see what happens.
Same with Captaintreacherou s (who as an aside they even gave an abbreviated 4yo campaign).
Racing in the Fan Duel will not make his foals eligible to M1 stake races And the buyers don’t care.
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When and where is the Fan Dual..TVG..race coming up?
2 weeks from tomorrow night at the Meadowlands. https://playmeadowlands.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/06/FANDUEL-FFA-CHAMPIONSHIP-PACE-may.pdf He has an invite. Races: The FanDuel Pace, FanDuel Trot, FanDuel Mare Trot, FanDuel Mare Pace, Valley Victory, Three Diamonds, Governor’s Cup & Goldsmith Maid.
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Racing in the Fan Duel will not make his foals eligible to M1 stake races And the buyers don’t care.
An injury would. 🤔
And the buyers absolutely care. Go to the sales and ask the buyers -- look at a big ticket yearling and find our he's not eligible for X, Y, or Z. It's business. Buy a $200,000 yearling without a major sire stakes program, and you ain't buying him for a late closer. These are grand circuit purchases (hopefully, LOL).
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An injury would. 🤔
And the buyers absolutely care. Go to the sales and ask the buyers -- look at a big ticket yearling and find our he's not eligible for X, Y, or Z. It's business. Buy a $200,000 yearling without a major sire stakes program, and you ain't buying him for a late closer. These are grand circuit purchases (hopefully, LOL).
What races do you think it disqualifies you for? Only 1 as a 3yr old pacer
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Downbytheseaaide doing just fine without M1 stakes. So did Greenshoe first 2 crops
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An injury would. 🤔
And the buyers absolutely care. Go to the sales and ask the buyers -- look at a big ticket yearling and find our he's not eligible for X, Y, or Z. It's business. Buy a $200,000 yearling without a major sire stakes program, and you ain't buying him for a late closer. These are grand circuit purchases (hopefully, LOL).
The horse is standing in PA they have a huge sire stake program.
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Downbytheseaaide doing just fine without M1 stakes. So did Greenshoe first 2 crops
And that's a marquee race for a stallion prospect. You don't make a stallion to do just fine and lose out on a marquee race. It ain't what it used to be, but that's a race that makes a stallion. If you aren't a commercial breeder it's all Greek.
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The horse is standing in PA they have a huge sire stake program.
You're kidding, right? A breeder wants to sell 200 and 300k yearlings, and the people who buy them are looking at sire stakes. Sire stakes is a fall-back position, it's an out, for a horse that is not top of the class.
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You're kidding, right? A breeder wants to sell 200 and 300k yearlings, and the people who buy them are looking at sire stakes. Sire stakes is a fall-back position, it's an out, for a horse that is not top of the class.
Name 1 stallion that the Gural rule has hurt. I can’t think of any. Looks like you right no one paying big money for the TDS offspring
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CON-federate did not really get challenged by his 3 year old crop. In the TVG he will be pushed to the limit by the faster older horses.
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Fan Duel is a no lose situation. If he wins it elevates him to one of the best 3yr olds. If he loses it took older horses to beat him and he still has his WR and a pretty nice season behind him. I know they used the other horse for a rabbit but no other horse has been able to move their legs that fast. Even after big 3/4 times
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It will be an interesting race. This was a very weak year for three year old pacers except for Confederate. Confederate's mark was set up by a stablemate. He will have to beat real horses in this race.
The "rabbit" has a 47.1 mark of his own so he's a real horse.
Statistically speaking this year has been the best for fast 3 year olds since 2019.
There were 23 horses taking a record of 49 flat or better in 2019, 23 in 2020, 24 in 2021, 18 in 2022, and 32 this year.
It looks like a weak group because Confederate is so much better than the others but the crop is really above average
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thank you thorn
good facts
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Would be curious to see how the average times have progressed in general in those years.
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What races do you think it disqualifies you for? Only 1 as a 3yr old pacer
Downbytheseaaide doing just fine without M1 stakes. So did Greenshoe first 2 crops
Greenshoe ? Only has one crop racing and it sucks with or without the rule. Look at the horrible sales prices this week
As for how many races it involves here is the current list and it's more than one.
https://playmeadowlands.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/11/SRC-with-Exclusion-REVISED-2.4.2022.pdf
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Greenshoe ? Only has one crop racing and it sucks with or without the rule. Look at the horrible sales prices this week
As for how many races it involves here is the current list and it's more than one.
https://playmeadowlands.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/11/SRC-with-Exclusion-REVISED-2.4.2022.pdf
How is Gural going to exclude horses racing in the Houghton and Doherty. They don’t go at his tacks. Empire Breeders is NY restricted. Jersey races are NJ restricted.
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That is an old posting. TDS not on it
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Trying to cover bad decisions.. not going to the Jug, the set up race for his (time trial) mark, the midnight Lex. Fiasco, and publicly saying the farm retains their best yearlings. Thats like having a steak cook off with them starting with the tenderloin and you a chunk of bottom round.
A couple more races is a win, win situation for them. If he wins he beats some aged horses, if he gets beat he got hurt and his get will be eligible for the Mlands Pace.
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bring back the time trials
no confusion there, you go on your own and create your own speed
i would put more credence in that than the "race he won"