Author Topic: A trainer at a crossroads.....  (Read 2900 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Grandstand Handicapper

  • Elite
  • ******
  • Posts: 2319
  • Which wolf wins? The one you feed.
A trainer at a crossroads.....
« on: November 16, 2025, 02:15:27 PM »
https://paulickreport.com/features/in-their-care/kirkpatrick-co-presents-in-their-care-back-in-the-u-s-trainer-jimmy-jerkens-at-a-crossroads

I get that he's a t-bred trainer, and maybe I wouldn't think about it if I hadn't met the guy-----and his dad-----but this is going on in the harness game too. Even more perhaps with harness racing with the current state of affairs. When I think about the harness game, way back in the day, I can't help but think about Dave Elliott. A truly great horseman, but just not a people person. When he was on top, people were sending him horses. Forget about soliciting and talking to owners, he didn't like talking to people, LOL. But a great horseman. His cousin, Steve Elliott, was a bit similar in that respect. Some excellent trainers just don't like, can't do, whatever, the business side of training.

Sakit

  • Open / FFA
  • ****
  • Posts: 432
Re: A trainer at a crossroads.....
« Reply #1 on: November 16, 2025, 03:51:53 PM »
https://paulickreport.com/features/in-their-care/kirkpatrick-co-presents-in-their-care-back-in-the-u-s-trainer-jimmy-jerkens-at-a-crossroads

I get that he's a t-bred trainer, and maybe I wouldn't think about it if I hadn't met the guy-----and his dad-----but this is going on in the harness game too. Even more perhaps with harness racing with the current state of affairs. When I think about the harness game, way back in the day, I can't help but think about Dave Elliott. A truly great horseman, but just not a people person. When he was on top, people were sending him horses. Forget about soliciting and talking to owners, he didn't like talking to people, LOL. But a great horseman. His cousin, Steve Elliott, was a bit similar in that respect. Some excellent trainers just don't like, can't do, whatever, the business side of training.
I wonder whatever happened to Dave last I heard he went back to Michigan

hammer0419

  • Stakes Horse
  • *****
  • Posts: 1389
Re: A trainer at a crossroads.....
« Reply #2 on: November 16, 2025, 03:58:37 PM »
Uber/Lyft in Florida. Not going to get into it. But Dave's issue's were more then his personality.

Sakit

  • Open / FFA
  • ****
  • Posts: 432
Re: A trainer at a crossroads.....
« Reply #3 on: November 16, 2025, 08:55:03 PM »
Uber/Lyft in Florida. Not going to get into it. But Dave's issue's were more then his personality.
I agree on Dave's issues

Casualfan1

  • Top Claimer
  • ***
  • Posts: 190
Re: A trainer at a crossroads.....
« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2025, 01:47:10 AM »
https://paulickreport.com/features/in-their-care/kirkpatrick-co-presents-in-their-care-back-in-the-u-s-trainer-jimmy-jerkens-at-a-crossroads

I get that he's a t-bred trainer, and maybe I wouldn't think about it if I hadn't met the guy-----and his dad-----but this is going on in the harness game too. Even more perhaps with harness racing with the current state of affairs. When I think about the harness game, way back in the day, I can't help but think about Dave Elliott. A truly great horseman, but just not a people person. When he was on top, people were sending him horses. Forget about soliciting and talking to owners, he didn't like talking to people, LOL. But a great horseman. His cousin, Steve Elliott, was a bit similar in that respect. Some excellent trainers just don't like, can't do, whatever, the business side of training.
After reading this article I always thought Tony Alagna working for Erv was perfect match for Tony is all salesman and like him or not Erv is an excellent horseman, night and day better than Tony but they were perfect fit.

Grandstand Handicapper

  • Elite
  • ******
  • Posts: 2319
  • Which wolf wins? The one you feed.
Re: A trainer at a crossroads.....
« Reply #5 on: November 17, 2025, 10:17:44 AM »
After reading this article I always thought Tony Alagna working for Erv was perfect match for Tony is all salesman and like him or not Erv is an excellent horseman, night and day better than Tony but they were perfect fit.

Excellent point. Tony was the PR guy, and was far more comfortable dealing with owners, relationship management, etc.-----and I know some of the owners were more comfortable dealing with Tony than Erv.

Way back it was similar with David Rovine and Joe Holloway. David was 1000% salesman, the ultimate promoter. Joe was the horseman. When Joe went on his own, the Rovine model just fell apart. Joe of course had to become the lead guy, do more PR, relationship management, and turn into a salesman a bit, and he did. He learned, LOL.

Sakit

  • Open / FFA
  • ****
  • Posts: 432
Re: A trainer at a crossroads.....
« Reply #6 on: November 18, 2025, 09:33:27 AM »
Excellent point. Tony was the PR guy, and was far more comfortable dealing with owners, relationship management, etc.-----and I know some of the owners were more comfortable dealing with Tony than Erv.

Way back it was similar with David Rovine and Joe Holloway. David was 1000% salesman, the ultimate promoter. Joe was the horseman. When Joe went on his own, the Rovine model just fell apart. Joe of course had to become the lead guy, do more PR, relationship management, and turn into a salesman a bit, and he did. He learned, LOL.
Joe has always been a great ambassador for the sport. Great trainer.

tumbleweed

  • Open / FFA
  • ****
  • Posts: 379
Re: A trainer at a crossroads.....
« Reply #7 on: November 18, 2025, 12:25:28 PM »
Joe has had many positives during his time. Wouldnt call that a great ambassador.

hoosierboy

  • Elite
  • ******
  • Posts: 11687
Re: A trainer at a crossroads.....
« Reply #8 on: November 18, 2025, 01:33:25 PM »
Excellent point. Tony was the PR guy, and was far more comfortable dealing with owners, relationship management, etc.-----and I know some of the owners were more comfortable dealing with Tony than Erv.

Way back it was similar with David Rovine and Joe Holloway. David was 1000% salesman, the ultimate promoter. Joe was the horseman. When Joe went on his own, the Rovine model just fell apart. Joe of course had to become the lead guy, do more PR, relationship management, and turn into a salesman a bit, and he did. He learned, LOL.

Well said

Sakit

  • Open / FFA
  • ****
  • Posts: 432
Re: A trainer at a crossroads.....
« Reply #9 on: November 19, 2025, 09:08:57 AM »
Joe has had many positives during his time. Wouldnt call that a great ambassador.
all great trainers did. I can remember owners following Pelling and Crogan around like they were the second coming little did
they know came out of a box of baking soda.

Grandstand Handicapper

  • Elite
  • ******
  • Posts: 2319
  • Which wolf wins? The one you feed.
Re: A trainer at a crossroads.....
« Reply #10 on: November 19, 2025, 11:53:22 AM »
Haughton, Dancer, Sholty, and other greats had positive tests. What for, to what extent, and much more subjective thinking is the real issue. I know owners who said they would never give a horse to Burke. I know others who have given him horses and praise him like who knows what. The same was said about Robinson, Artandi, Steve Elliott, Pelling, Croghan, and can be said about many trainers. I never heard people say that about Chuck Sylvester. Nor about Ray/Larry Remmen. I guess it's about where it your vomit point. LOL.

Sakit

  • Open / FFA
  • ****
  • Posts: 432
Re: A trainer at a crossroads.....
« Reply #11 on: November 19, 2025, 07:20:22 PM »
Haughton, Dancer, Sholty, and other greats had positive tests. What for, to what extent, and much more subjective thinking is the real issue. I know owners who said they would never give a horse to Burke. I know others who have given him horses and praise him like who knows what. The same was said about Robinson, Artandi, Steve Elliott, Pelling, Croghan, and can be said about many trainers. I never heard people say that about Chuck Sylvester. Nor about Ray/Larry Remmen. I guess it's about where it your vomit point. LOL.
all the great trainers pre raced maybe not to the extent they do now, but they all tried to get an advantage.

Kirby's Ace

  • Elite
  • ******
  • Posts: 3103
  • Member HPPC
Re: A trainer at a crossroads.....
« Reply #12 on: November 19, 2025, 07:34:32 PM »
There was a guy years ago selling a shot 10cc of prerace he called White Lightning. I'm sure local Delaware and Maryland guys knows who I'm talking about. Trainers were buying this preface like no tomorrow including me. Then I got a shot, it was the last shot from that bottle so he just ripped the label off and said here. Well he didn't get all the label off and I discovered his 100 shot of White Lightning was Flucort! You can buy the bottle at that time for 50 bucks! And that was a100 cc bottle!
I hunt big mouth Triggers

Sakit

  • Open / FFA
  • ****
  • Posts: 432
Re: A trainer at a crossroads.....
« Reply #13 on: November 19, 2025, 08:10:15 PM »
There was a guy years ago selling a shot 10cc of prerace he called White Lightning. I'm sure local Delaware and Maryland guys knows who I'm talking about. Trainers were buying this preface like no tomorrow including me. Then I got a shot, it was the last shot from that bottle so he just ripped the label off and said here. Well he didn't get all the label off and I discovered his 100 shot of White Lightning was Flucort! You can buy the bottle at that time for 50 bucks! And that was a100 cc bottle!
vets made a fortune pre-racing this is before Pelling and Crogan started with the tube.

 

shout out

Refresh History
  • Sound off !
  • Trigger: They did.  They stopped though.  No fucking deterrent.
    November 19, 2025, 10:53:12 PM
  • Ignorance Is Bliss: Nobody truly appreciates the unbelievable job the FBI did.
    November 19, 2025, 10:45:13 PM
  • Trigger: What no drug work for him  ngc3
    November 19, 2025, 10:34:12 PM
  • Ignorance Is Bliss: He talks about his anxiety in his testimony. Panic attacks.  ngc3
    November 19, 2025, 10:26:46 PM
  • Trigger: Harness rats seem like the biggest cowards.  Feds probably had to give him tissues and tape his mouth closed to get him to stop.
    November 19, 2025, 09:09:24 PM
  • LUCPARK: Wdf I never thought or knew shit like that about him.   I’m floored
    November 19, 2025, 08:53:42 PM
  • LUCPARK: Mike where can I read that agreement. Or can u pls post the whole agreement. I know this guy personally. Thks mike
    November 19, 2025, 08:52:53 PM
  • Ignorance Is Bliss: I just read the agreement Dr. Skelton made to stay out of prison for doing the same Fishman was doing, AND he's still licensed in Indiana to practice.
    November 19, 2025, 08:44:17 PM
SimplePortal 2.3.7 © 2008-2025, SimplePortal