Harness Racing Is The Very Definition Of Welfare Supported

[M P]

And then there's Maine, the fair racing capital of the nation. Average yearly earnings per horse just over 11k. Again....TAXPAYER SUBSIDY.....ya know, welfare?

[Crash]

Documented or undocumented, each of those people need to be fed. Working for it is far better than eating at a charity or stealing to survive. A diversion to a second argument still reveals your darker side. I’m not in favor of dead horses and kill pens either, but when preferences come into play I side with human welfare over animal welfare any day. Jmho.

[M P]

Documented or undocumented, each of those people need to be fed. Working for it is far better than eating at a charity or stealing to survive. A diversion to a second argument still reveals your darker side. I’m not in favor of dead horses and kill pens either, but when preferences come into play I side with human welfare over animal welfare any day. Jmho.

There's plenty of other jobs out there. So put good money behind bad to support an illicit industry that defrauds the public and endangers animals to feed people who can easily work elsewhere. Yeah, OK. 

[dougie]

While Mr. Petrelli makes good points, I have met many people in the"business". Most are hard working folks who love their horses. I hope that harness racing survives. Despite the "corporate welfare" which they receive.

[Grandstand Handicapper]

Sure, the lowest being on track handle and in house revenue from live patrons. The rest is welfare. Thank you for asking. Take away the subsidies and tell me what you're racing for. I'll wait.

So, when Monmouth Park "received" monies to not bring in VLT's, those dollars were a subsidy? When Aqueduct (NYRA) received monies----both from NY State and Genting----those dollars were a type of subsidy? What about the original deal in Ontario, when the Government, and the Ontario Lottery and Gaming Corporation gave dollars to the racetracks? Were those dollars also some type of subsidy? I am just trying to get some distinction here on your perspective.

[Crash]

Ok… let’s stop producing cars that are creating pollution and killing our planet. Let’s shut down farms that produce animal related goods and by products because animals die needlessly and there are bad actors in those industries too… we’ll retrain everybody who had no real skills at age 50+ to be carpenters and welders. 90% of the people involved I. Harness racing love the horses … unfortunately you’re to blinded by the vendetta and prefer only to see and focus on the other 10%.

[M P]

Ok… let’s stop producing cars that are creating pollution and killing our planet. Let’s shut down farms that produce animal related goods and by products because animals die needlessly and there are bad actors in those industries too… we’ll retrain everybody who had no real skills at age 50+ to be carpenters and welders. 90% of the people involved I. Harness racing love the horses … unfortunately you’re to blinded by the vendetta and prefer only to see and focus on the other 10%.

Harness racing loses money each day without subsidy. So should EVERY business that operates at a loss be supported by the taxpayers? KMart, Sears, every small business killed by big box stores, rotary phones, the 8-track.....shall I continue? How many animals did Ma and Pa Hardware Store endanger? How many people did they fuck over using drugs and fixing races? How many animals ended up slaughtered? Sears helped build the country, poof. What about all those people who worked there for decades? Did they cry "this is all we know" like the stall muckers of  America do when the free ride is threatened? Sorry, your argument fails as bad as the industry. It's over. Stop taking other people's money that should be earmarked for people like teachers, nurses, law enforcement, EMTs, firefighters, Veterans.....not professional shit shovelers who cry they can't go anywhere else.

[Crash]

Blinded by the vendetta against an industry… evil has overcome your soul.

[M P]

Blinded by the vendetta against an industry… evil has overcome your soul.

You're right. Against the industry. Not the sport. Your industry is a loss and criminal. The sport is dying because you have done nothing to change the industry. Thanks for playing.

[Crash]

Not playing… proving you have a biased view with truths. I feel sorry for you.

[The Unstable]

So what???  Tell us something new.  Does everone cry when Amazon gets millions of dollars in tax brakes to build a warehouse and creates worse and lower paying job.  One thing good about harness racing the jobs are hands on.  Not only that they create far more revenue for the state in taxes and jobs created then Amazon and others per dollars.  Did you cry when harness racing gave the states 25 percent of millions in the golden age?  Obviously there is rampant cheating issue but welfare is for people not working, at last check my harness trainers are mostly the hardest working people I know.

Take away subsidies there would be no ballet, opera, many museums etc.  Maybe take away subsidies for stadiums etc, yet we only bitch about harness racing and constantly call it welfare. 

Also lots of that money that flows through is taxed, and there is something called income tax that most states have.  So the amount spent as a dollar amount costs the states far less. that is  basic economics.  And yes harness racing would be out of business without slot money but so would most dance and theater groups be too. Heck farmers get subsidies not to grow food. In fact farmers get free water and it takes over 3 gallons to make one almond!  wouldn't it be better to divert that water to drought areas then sudsidize almonds??? People who get flood insurance get a subsidy through the government as it would cost far more to insure on the open market. 

Sorry i'm just sick of harness racing being pointed out all the time.  I get it, the public thinks what we do is cruel and useless, it is a easy target.  I think ballet is useless.

[M P]

So what???  Tell us something new.  Does everone cry when Amazon gets millions of dollars in tax brakes to build a warehouse and creates worse and lower paying job.  One thing good about harness racing the jobs are hands on.  Not only that they create far more revenue for the state in taxes and jobs created then Amazon and others per dollars.  Did you cry when harness racing gave the states 25 percent of millions in the golden age?  Obviously there is rampant cheating issue but welfare is for people not working, at last check my harness trainers are mostly the hardest working people I know.

Take away subsidies there would be no ballet, opera, many museums etc.  Maybe take away subsidies for stadiums etc, yet we only bitch about harness racing and constantly call it welfare. 

Also lots of that money that flows through is taxed, and there is something called income tax that most states have.  So the amount spent as a dollar amount costs the states far less. that is  basic economics.  And yes harness racing would be out of business without slot money but so would most dance and theater groups be too.

Are people shoving needles and tubes into those dancers then having the public bet on them? I don't remember reading that the federal government indicted anyone on Broadway for selling non detectable drugs used on actors that caused their hearts to fail.

[The Unstable]

Are people shoving needles and tubes into those dancers then having the public bet on them? I don't remember reading that the federal government indicted anyone on Broadway for selling non detectable drugs used on actors that caused their hearts to fail.

No (nor does everyone do it) .  If you think horse racing should be banned for all it's misgivings, so be it.  Breeding a mare over and over is cruel to some but yet you still eat burgers i'm guessing. Are you vegetarian because honestly sentinel animals from a purely ethical standpoint shouldn't be eaten.  But yet we do. 

From a strictly welfare point harness racing is no different then many other industries and organizations.  You hate harness racing because you think it is cruel and for the reprehensible behavior that many exibit.  But you conflate that and call it welfare, it isn't.  It just might make it a poor choice for monies if that's what one believes.

You obviously care about the horses and that's appreciated and respected by me but I do take exception to you calling it welfare (for the tenth time).  Also your take on Yonkers and Faraldo much respected by me. I get it is hard to be sympathetic to the Faraldos bilking Yonkers and the SOA.  But that is corruption.  To punish the people who have nothing to do with him seems unfair. 

For me I do have ethical issues about the sport, but I guess I am too ingrained in it.  Perhaps that makes me a hypocrite. But i'm a hypocrite everytime I take a bite of chicken. 

PS many of those ballerinas and dancers have been sexually abused.  Many are aneorexic and have stunted puberty and don't menstruate.  Same as gymnasts.  And people yet go and pay to see them.

[wiseowl]

Who cares where the purses come from lets just race and enjoy it while e can cause someday it well all go away.

[Wild bull]

All you clowns talk about is why aren't they "giving" you more. You actually got that part right. Nothing earned. You even say the people who saved racetracks are only driven by money, yet you don't hesitate to take the welfare and drink the Kool-Aid. Only time any of you talk is here because you are scared shitless knowing what will happen if you get caught. They yank your free ride. When you walk in most paddocks it's no different than walking into a social services office. Same thing, prove me wrong. 

.   Hey scm your the best you call the people of the plop losers because the post on here but yet your dumb ass posted 18 times in just over three hours and eight in a row but it's ok just keep telling yourself it's everyone else around you that's the problem dummy to bad you weren't working at the WTC on 9/11 the world would be a lot better without a pile of shit like you now go find someone who has wronged you and throw them under the bus for no reason except for revenge not for the good of the business