HORSEPLOP.COM
General Category => Harness Racing => Topic started by: PurpleSheetPicks on May 24, 2026, 10:42:15 AM
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Miracle maven ends up 1 to 5 last night .
2 to 1 morning line against very string field
4 to 5 going to the gate is OK, almost even money but then as the gate springs 1 to 5.
Against 80% less return then the low price to begin with
No modern gambler is going to tolerate this stuff .
You want to save the sport?
We thought we needed to push horse ownership. We dont.
People will always buy racehorses. Prices for racehorses are through the roof.
The sport needs gamblers.
No big money gamblers will tolerate 80% reductions in payoffs..
It was one thing when this had been going on at b tracks but when its routinely happening Saturday night at meadowlands its a screaming issue
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SO TRUE
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The sport needs gamblers.
if this sport needed gamblers to survive it would have been
gone 25 years ago.. doesnt matter if there is 20,000 or 200,000 handle
for any race.. the only way this sport survives is on the welfare of casinos.
thats it..anything else is just noise
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2 things can be true at once
Fixed odds is needed, but won't happen
The gamblers always get shit on.. CAW 's suck, killing small time players
Back in the day, gamblers were needed..not so much anymore
All slot welfare
Ohio was dead in the water until the racinos came
$1600 purses throughout the week at Scioto.
Place was a ghost town.
All these topics have been discussed at nauseum
Nothing changes ;D
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2 things can be true at once
Fixed odds is needed, but won't happen
The gamblers always get shit on.. CAW 's suck, killing small time players
Back in the day, gamblers were needed..not so much anymore
All slot welfare
Ohio was dead in the water until the racinos came
$1600 purses throughout the week at Scioto.
Place was a ghost town.
All these topics have been discussed at nauseum
Nothing changes ;D
Unfortunately the slot welfare wont last. It was mandatory that casinos needed to give a percentage back to racing before. Now casinos can open without racing.
The welfare about to end. We need to bring the gambler back.
Caw at least produces handle so there is no way to get rid of that
But no one is betting real momey without having any idea of the return, which drops as much as 80%, even at the last moment.
It was one thing if a horse steadily drops odds. But the sudden 80% changes will break this business more than ANY other issue it has
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No big money handicapper is ever betting a 4/5 to win looking for ROI. Only degenerates
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Miracle maven ends up 1 to 5 last night .
2 to 1 morning line against very string field
4 to 5 going to the gate is OK, almost even money but then as the gate springs 1 to 5.
Against 80% less return then the low price to begin with
No modern gambler is going to tolerate this stuff .
You want to save the sport?
We thought we needed to push horse ownership. We dont.
People will always buy racehorses. Prices for racehorses are through the roof.
The sport needs gamblers.
No big money gamblers will tolerate 80% reductions in payoffs..
It was one thing when this had been going on at b tracks but when its routinely happening Saturday night at meadowlands its a screaming issue
This has been happening for 35+ years. NOTHING NEW!! ngc3 ngc3
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In the pre-simulcast era when handle was all on track it didn't happen.
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No big money handicapper is ever betting a 4/5 to win looking for ROI. Only degenerates
You couldn't be more wrong. Betting public loves throwing momey on 4 to 5. Ask sports gamblers who lay -110
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In the pre-simulcast era when handle was all on track it didn't happen.
Thank yoi for shutting down the its always been this way morons. It hasnt
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Thank yoi for shutting down the its always been this way morons. It hasnt
Is your action sharp?
If so, what exactly would you do if everything switched to fixed odds? How many beard accounts could you possibly have at your disposal....and that's a major pain the ass.
There is 0% chance any track will allow sharp money.
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Is your action sharp?
If so, what exactly would you do if everything switched to fixed odds? How many beard accounts could you possibly have at your disposal....and that's a major pain the ass.
There is 0% chance any track will allow sharp money.
No such thing as sharp momey thats a myth to make gamblers think they have a chance. Amd of course if a track is taking too much money at the stated odds they are welcome to lower them, especially if they think the person betting might be onto something. They could actually use ot to their advantage like the books have been for years. You guys make it sound like its impossible rocket science. It isnt
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No such thing as sharp momey thats a myth to make gamblers think they have a chance. Amd of course if a track is taking too much money at the stated odds they are welcome to lower them, especially if they think the person betting might be onto something. They could actually use ot to their advantage like the books have been for years. You guys make it sound like its impossible rocket science. It isnt
This has been happening for 35+ years. NOTHING NEW!! ngc3 ngc3
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This has been happening for 35+ years. NOTHING NEW!! ngc3 ngc3
I knew a moron like you just had to chime in.
Kill yourself
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Is your action sharp?
If so, what exactly would you do if everything switched to fixed odds? How many beard accounts could you possibly have at your disposal....and that's a major pain the ass.
There is 0% chance any track will allow sharp money.
Just to clarify fixed odds csn change, the track can adjust them as needed. but the bettor is locked in at whatever odds it was when they bet, just like every other form of gambling. Keep the exotics parimutual but win odds need to be fixed
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No such thing as sharp momey thats a myth to make gamblers think they have a chance. Amd of course if a track is taking too much money at the stated odds they are welcome to lower them, especially if they think the person betting might be onto something. They could actually use ot to their advantage like the books have been for years. You guys make it sound like its impossible rocket science. It isnt
It is impossible. Tracks will never carry wagering risk.
Parimutuel is the best form of gambling ever.
The problem with it is that CAW is allowed
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It is impossible. Tracks will never carry wagering risk.
Parimutuel is the best form of gambling ever.
The problem with it is that CAW is allowed
Everything in life is risk
Trackside are in a risky business. They can take some risk
If they play their cards right they csn make a fortune doing it.
Bettors are notoriously wrong. Take your smart money and stick it up your ass lol
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Everything in life is risk
Trackside are in a risky business. They can take some risk
If they play their cards right they csn make a fortune doing it.
Bettors are notoriously wrong. Take your smart money and stick it up your ass lol
In my experience, people who cant win like to think that nobody can
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In my experience, people who cant win like to think that nobody can
tmbz1 tmbz1 ngc3 ngc3
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In my experience, people who cant win like to think that nobody can
Find me a winning lomg term gambler.
I wont hold my breath
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In my experience, people who cant win like to think that nobody can
Just for the record ive won or placed in every handicapping contest ive entered. I also was market maker on the floor of the cboe. I know a thing or two about odds
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In my experience, people who cant win like to think that nobody can
And yes NOBODY wins gambling long term
Anyone who tells you otherwise is a liar or doesnt know
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You guys want to sit back and watch the sport die thats on you
This is the change the sport needs.
A track doesn't want risk? I get that, but taking some risk is a better option than watching handle shrink to zero and rolling over and dying
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You guys want to sit back and watch the sport die thats on you
This is the change the sport needs.
A track doesn't want risk? I get that, but taking some risk is a better option than watching handle shrink to zero and rolling over and dying
Yes please!
I'd like to participate in its death too.
Sport? ngc3
Every sport I know has rules, and relies heavily on its fans, not cheat them.
Change, yes for sure...kill the son of a b!tch, twice! ;D
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Yes please!
I'd like to participate in its death too.
Sport? ngc3
Every sport I know has rules, and relies heavily on its fans, not cheat them.
Change, yes for sure...kill the son of a b!tch, twice! ;D
Says a guy that found his way to a harness racing forum?
Your denial is strong your psychiatrist is in deep lol
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Churchill Downs Sportsbook thought no one could beat racing.
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Says a guy that found his way to a harness racing forum?
Your denial is strong your psychiatrist is in deep lol
Don't be a woke snowflake ngc3
You know, everyone knows harness racing must die ngc3
Die a slow, painful death ngc3
Then you can resurrect the former abomination, if you can turn it into something legit ngc3
Fans, gamblers, legitimate participants<--------Harness Racing----------> Crooks, drugged up horses, compromised participants, corrupted officials, casinos, politicians, organized crime
Winner! hvc.1
I have duty to myself, to come here and enjoy myself and if horse racing was a living thing I'd beat it to death, set it on fire and piss on its ashes ngc3
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And yes NOBODY wins gambling long term
Anyone who tells you otherwise is a liar or doesnt know
A delusional perspective, based on total ignorance
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A delusional perspective, based on total ignorance
Ill put my money where my mouth is.
Ill make fixed odds for your sharpest horse racing sharps lol.
Laughing at you actually thknk their are sharp horse players
There are simply too many factors to make a profit long term
Ask stu unger
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You can beat a race, you cant beat the races.
Thats a fact
Its your ignorance and delusion that tells you otherwise.
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Matmatician Louis bacheliar proved in rhe stock market and any other betting market that the unknown is too powerful.
Im done arguing with you thats not the point of this
Its just my honest attempt to save the sport that I and many others love with a reasonable option that am established gambler and market maker like myself knows will help. You want to try to beat fixed odds racing. Go for it. Good luck
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Matmatician Louis bacheliar proved in rhe stock market and any other betting market that the unknown is too powerful.
Im done arguing with you thats not the point of this
Its just my honest attempt to save the sport that I and many others love with a reasonable option that am established gambler and market maker like myself knows will help. You want to try to beat fixed odds racing. Go for it. Good luck
The majority of legitimate owners are getting killed because they are racing against peds and a rigged system...they're down to fractional ownerships.
Minimum wagers used to be $2 minimums now they're .10.
First pick mostly winners ngc3 then let's see your w/l spreadsheet on fixed wagers...Good Luck, I'm all for legit gamblers winning in the dawn of CAW!
Y'all, me are ROLE PLAYERS, those that rig and run this sport entertainment game and make sure it stays rigged are KEY PLAYERS!
You want in as a key player, you better arm up, and man up! ;D
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have to agree purple
something needs to be done
i am not sure of the answer but i have no interest in betting 1/5 horses or worse, too much can go wrong to justify those low odds
and it happens at most racks on a regular basis
Monday night , mohawk race 10 horse 6 was another example, 4/5 behind the gate , 3/5 as gate leaves, 1/5 going into the first turn
no thanks
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A delusional perspective, based on total ignorance
tmbz1 tmbz1 tmbz1 ngc3 ngc3 ngc3
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It is impossible. Tracks will never carry wagering risk.
Parimutuel is the best form of gambling ever.
tmbz1 tmbz1 tmbz1
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You want to try to beat fixed odds racing. Go for it. Good luck
I know many people that win gambling. You're hanging with fellow losers.
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have to agree purple
something needs to be done
i am not sure of the answer but i have no interest in betting 1/5 horses or worse, too much can go wrong to justify those low odds
and it happens at most racks on a regular basis
Monday night , mohawk race 10 horse 6 was another example, 4/5 behind the gate , 3/5 as gate leaves, 1/5 going into the first turn
no thanks
When its happening at mohawk and meadowlands we are doomed.
Thr change needs to be made now before the handle totally disappears
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Just happened again at Poconos race 2. Horse is 4 to 1 morning line. Sitting as an underlay at 2 to 1 going to the gate. Then flashes 3 to 5.
70% less expected value off an already low underlay
Its disgusting. I dont even make win bets anymore because of it but whoever did get the 3 to 5 instead of 2 to 1 is going to be pissed. Almost guaranteed they will step down their win bets after this rather than have them go up after a win.
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Just happened again at Poconos race 2.
It happens 10 times a day. EVERYDAY! For 50 years!!! ngc3 ngc3 ngc3 ngc3 You're clearly a novice.
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It happens 10 times a day. EVERYDAY! For 50 years!!! ngc3 ngc3 ngc3 ngc3 You're clearly a novice.
Actually when I got into the game in the 90s it would drop from. 2 to 1 to 8 to 5...
There weren't 80 percent drops..
Since you dint understand stats and standard deviation you are treating all changes in odds the same.
I won't take the time to explain the difference
Ask all those gamblers that make money that you know maybe they will explain
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Pacer 2 lives in a fantasy world. Anyone with half a brain knows the big drops in odds are from the CAW's. Prior to simulcasting, big odds fluctuations were rare because the money all came from on track.
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Pacer 2 lives in a fantasy world. Anyone with half a brain knows the big drops in odds are from the CAW's. Prior to simulcasting, big odds fluctuations were rare because the money all came from on track.
Caws don't ever play longshots?
They just hammer favs? That cant be profitable long term
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I don't know what CAW's bet. What's also happening is, some of the off track wagering hub money isn't being added to the pools all along, instead a major chunk is put in right before the race starts which helps to cause the odds fluctuations. If the money came in every few minutes like it should, you wouldn't see 2-1 hammered down to 4-5 after the race starts.
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Pacer 2 lives in a fantasy world. Anyone with half a brain knows the big drops in odds are from the CAW's. Prior to simulcasting, big odds fluctuations were rare because the money all came from on track.
100%
CAW is the issue. The late odds change issue could be resolved if CAWs were cut off from the win pool several minutes before post. But gural will never go for that. Remember he reversed course on eliminating drag because he said the CAWs technology couldn't adjust and weren't able to place their bets in the very wagering cycle. Handle plummeted.
For whatever reason, the CAW $ at Meadowlands is heavily leveraged to favorites. That started a few years ago.
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Caws don't ever play longshots?
They just hammer favs? That cant be profitable long term
CAW's bet horses of all odds including longshots.
There is no such thing as the favorite until the pools are closed, you know that.
CAW's are responsible in many instances as we all know for the drastic drop in odds of many winning horses, and done where it doesn't reflect until the pools close.
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My great-great-great-great-great-great-grandchildren will have been dead 100 years before there is any serious fixed odds for harness racing. It has been tried. E-horse had E-horseX. It was styled after BetFair. There was ZERO market. A few people tried to be market makers, but the action was typically less than 100 for all horses combined. That was 20+ years ago, when harness racing actually had a spot in the world of sport. Since then, the interest has dwindled and I find myself increasingly less sad with each track closure.
It was pointed out that people will always buy horses. That is only true to the extent that purses remain slot infused. If that were to dry up tomorrow, the sales would see drastic reductions, and within a few years, I'm guessing we'd be looking at levels around 10-25% of current.
The real key to create a bet-able sport, is to make it competitive and interesting. Harness racing seems hell bent on making it uncompetitive, and it sure as hell isn't interesting to anyone not already in love with it.
And, does winning with the rebate/discount/bonus count? If so, I might argue it can be beat.
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CAW's bet horses of all odds including longshots.
There is no such thing as the favorite until the pools are closed, you know that.
CAW's are responsible in many instances as we all know for the drastic drop in odds of many winning horses, and done where it doesn't reflect until the pools close.
Can you just stop with your vanilla bs trying to hear yourself? U are adding nothing with your "the favorite isn't determined to the end" bs
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Can you just stop with your vanilla bs trying to hear yourself? U are adding nothing with your "the favorite isn't determined to the end" bs
Crybaby who started this thread ngc3
You really found your traction at plop ngc3
The place where concepts turn into F'ing inventions ngc3
Where ideologies turn into policy ngc3
Go do something about something, out there, instead you actually argue with other people who are more likely to get it done than your sissy anonymous ass! ngc3
Then comeback HERE with something, wow, what a coward yenta washerwoman! ngc3
Gamblers, men turned into weak bitches, thank christ this is my last year gambling in anything...after that you can gather more crybabies ngc3
You act like you invented fixed odds and lobbied for states to legalize, who the F are you kidding! Go do it, win and prove it here! ;D