HORSEPLOP.COM
General Category => Harness Racing => Topic started by: Laag on October 08, 2025, 04:08:04 PM
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Is their really a market for Captain Optimstic at stud rather than racing him as a 4 YO
https://ustrottingnews.com/deo-volente-farms-to-stand-captain-optimistic-in-2026/
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We will be able to measure Nancy's promotion by the number of yearnings she buys from his first crop!
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What is the plop guess on the stud fee?
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15k
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15k
There's no way. $8K and even that is generous.
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There are so many Captain Optimistic’s out there.
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There's no way. $8K and even that is generous.
I would not send a donkey to him only because there are 20 or 30 out there that are more appealing
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I got excited to read this topic. Can never have to many new studs out there. Let’s get the semen flowing.
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Nice colt, big, good pedigree, very good family, campaigned at the highest level and had a few days in the spotlight. He might make a showcase stallion somewhere else, but not in NJ. He's a second tier stallion. Sire stakes horses sure, grand circuit, exception, not the norm. Who knows, they might try and make him a top-tier stud. Gulotta is a heavyweight, he has some good broodmares, and he's well respected. This colt will be the first Captaintreacherou s standing in NJ (I think), and NJ doesn't have much in the way of top stallions these days. There's also "political" and "business" motivations here.
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you never know where a good stud might comer from ...right lance !!!!
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and there goes another one...Sabonis
https://ustrottingnews.com/diamond-creek-announces-hoosier-hero-sabonis-to-stand-stud-in-indiana-in-2026/
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and there goes another one...Sabonis
https://ustrottingnews.com/diamond-creek-announces-hoosier-hero-sabonis-to-stand-stud-in-indiana-in-2026/
Some offspring name suggestions...
Little Boner
Big Boner
She Likes Boners
Bonissimo / Bonissima Boners ngc3
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for some of these marginal ( appear to be marginal now) there is not a lot of money changing hands
but who knows where the next good one comes from
tall dark stranger was a cant miss and he did
chapter seven was a who cares early and now dominates
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well i certainly wouldnt write of talk dark stranger yet
so how many of these average horses will we have....joining the ranks of Gulf Shores, Beach Glass, Pebble Beach, Boston Red Rocks, Catch the Fire, Tattoo Artist, Captain Crunch...really whats the point. I suppose Captain Albano is headed to stud
Louprint going to dominate and his daddy is still so attractive.
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well i certainly wouldnt write of talk dark stranger yet
so how many of these average horses will we have....joining the ranks of Gulf Shores, Beach Glass, Pebble Beach, Boston Red Rocks, Catch the Fire, Tattoo Artist, Captain Crunch...really whats the point. I suppose Captain Albano is headed to stud
Louprint going to dominate and his daddy is still so attractive.
Stallions today I think it all depends on where they stand. Some
Of the horses you listed stand in regional or smaller programs. Tatoo Artist probably fits in that program, the Gukf Shores horse stands in Minnesota where he’s hands the best. I agree on Sweet Lou and Louprint certainly has the credentials to do it nationally.
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not suggesting tds cannot produce a good/great horse, especially if burke has some more of them
but as a commercial stallion he is toast , averaged $18k at lexington and likely lower at harrisburg
none of the big farms are breeding top mares to him
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well i certainly wouldnt write of talk dark stranger yet
so how many of these average horses will we have....joining the ranks of Gulf Shores, Beach Glass, Pebble Beach, Boston Red Rocks, Catch the Fire, Tattoo Artist, Captain Crunch...really whats the point. I suppose Captain Albano is headed to stud
Louprint going to dominate and his daddy is still so attractive.
Not sure where the obvious place to stand Louprint will be. In PA you already have Lou plus Confederate. No need to stand in KY given dual eligibility. Indiana’s program is kind of bleh and I can’t see them standing something like that in NY with all the bull rings. Ohio or New Jersey???
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Not sure where the obvious place to stand Louprint will be. In PA you already have Lou plus Confederate. No need to stand in KY given dual eligibility. Indiana’s program is kind of bleh and I can’t see them standing something like that in NY with all the bull rings. Ohio or New Jersey???
Maybe Ontario. There is Bulldog and Cattlewash....pos sibly a good spot for those wanting the Sweet Lou line??
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for some of these marginal ( appear to be marginal now) there is not a lot of money changing hands
but who knows where the next good one comes from
tall dark stranger was a cant miss and he did
chapter seven was a who cares early and now dominates
I don't know what people would thing Tall Dark Stranger would be a top sire....there hasn't really been a son of Bettors Delight hit at that level yet.
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Not sure where the obvious place to stand Louprint will be. In PA you already have Lou plus Confederate. No need to stand in KY given dual eligibility. Indiana’s program is kind of bleh and I can’t see them standing something like that in NY with all the bull rings. Ohio or New Jersey???
Confederate stands in Kentucky.
I would think Hanover could be a good option as they do not have a Sweet Lou line stallion and it would show their commitment to invest in a top stallion as they have been quiet the past few years since Dr. Jablonsky left.
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Confederate stands in Kentucky.
I would think Hanover could be a good option as they do not have a Sweet Lou line stallion and it would show their commitment to invest in a top stallion as they have been quiet the past few years since Dr. Jablonsky left.
Burke / Mark Weaver may do this themselves.
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He has one testicle unless you’re Greg Luther his sperm test is going to determine first where he’s going to stand.
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REGARDLESS OF WHAT YOU HEARD, I AM NOT OFF TO STUD. STILL TRAINING AS USUAL.
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Confederate is in Pennsylvania
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Confederate stands in Kentucky.
I would think Hanover could be a good option as they do not have a Sweet Lou line stallion and it would show their commitment to invest in a top stallion as they have been quiet the past few years since Dr. Jablonsky left.
Confederate is Diamond Creek PA and Hanover already has Papi Rab and Captain.
I thought about Ontario and Burke has been there a bit more but it’s harder to make them dual eligible and it’s still very provincial.
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He has one testicle unless you’re Greg Luther his sperm test is going to determine first where he’s going to stand.
Personally, I’ve never been scared of just one testicle. Obviously two is nice but one does the job.
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Personally, I’ve never been scared of just one testicle. Obviously two is nice but one does the job.
There are man / woman whores, that have fucked thousands, likely never saw, felt, licked, were tea-bagged by a monorchid, which I only learned just now.
I'm in awe of you, and how much experience you have.
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There are man / woman whores, that have fucked thousands, likely never saw, felt, licked, were tea-bagged by a monorchid, which I only learned just now.
I'm in awe of you, and how much experience you have.
I believe Cam Fella only had one nut.
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I believe Cam Fella only had one nut.
Correct, after he lost one to (I believe) cancer.
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Correct, after he lost one to (I believe) cancer.
Actually, Cam Fella was a ridgling his entire life-----sold as a yearling, raced his entire career, and then went to stud as a ridgling as well. Later on, he developed cancer in his remaining testicle, and he was gelded.
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Actually, Cam Fella was a ridgling his entire life-----sold as a yearling, raced his entire career, and then went to stud as a ridgling as well. Later on, he developed cancer in his remaining testicle, and he was gelded.
tmbz1
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cant see Ontario, too big of a fish for Ontario , bulldog was different, he wasn't bulldog when that was decided and he was owned by Canadians
i wold suggest hanover, captain is aging and while still performing they need a replacement
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15k
Not even close. 5K -- maybe 6K if he comes up huge in his remaining starts. And huge meaning he
defeats Louprint. He was all out winning the Bluegrass in .48 against a sub-par field. And so far, there
hasn't been a successful son of Treacherous at stud.
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Not sure where the obvious place to stand Louprint will be. In PA you already have Lou plus Confederate. No need to stand in KY given dual eligibility. Indiana’s program is kind of bleh and I can’t see them standing something like that in NY with all the bull rings. Ohio or New Jersey???
The logical place for Louprint is Ohio. Great market for a Jug winner and only one top tier stallion standing there. He should easily get 15K-20K.
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so this is becoming ridiculous now...more and more studs but no top races horses for next year....i dont get the point, its so oversaturated
so not only Louprint but Searoc, Captain Optimistic, Sabonis, Abuckabett, now Nijinksy the latest and will Captain Albano be far behind. How can the sport sustain this when you have dominance from horses like Sweet Lou, Huntsville, Seaside and Treachous and Miki still popping out good ones and Confederates are coming soon and you still have Tall Dark Stranger and Perfect Stings with Pebble Beaches coming.
and yet we have a horse shortage..how is that possible
now Super Chapter off to stud and will Maryland be far behind. '
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laag, you are correct and just like all markets it will correct
survival of the fittest in the short term
will certainly keep stud fees low on the mediocre ones and gives breeders lots of choice
of course still waiting for confederate, cannibal, legendary hanover etc so yes the market is flooded on both pacers and trotters
you would think that with the kentucky 4 yr old program ( which is excellent) and the aged series offered at yonkers that more owners would race at 4 and 5
but the quick money of breeding is to tempting, assume 100 bookings at $10,000 per and you have $1,000,000 without racing
but if they don't hit in year one or two they are toast and quickly become an afterthought and a regional sire mostly for people breeding to race their own stock
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the quick money of breeding is to tempting, assume 100 bookings at $10,000 per and you have $1,000,000 without racing
100 bookings doesn't = 100 paid stud fees.
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laag, you are correct and just like all markets it will correct
survival of the fittest in the short term
will certainly keep stud fees low on the mediocre ones and gives breeders lots of choice
of course still waiting for confederate, cannibal, legendary hanover etc so yes the market is flooded on both pacers and trotters
you would think that with the kentucky 4 yr old program ( which is excellent) and the aged series offered at yonkers that more owners would race at 4 and 5
but the quick money of breeding is to tempting, assume 100 bookings at $10,000 per and you have $1,000,000 without racing
but if they don't hit in year one or two they are toast and quickly become an afterthought and a regional sire mostly for people breeding to race their own stock
Age old argument. For a true, real, top horse, the class leader, even the second best horse, unfortunately, the economics dictate. If you have a farm willing to front the money, syndicate him, and then pay you the remainder, you simply can't race. Very little upside, and a lot of downside. It sucks, but it's the economics. The commercial breeders drive the boat and they are hurting the industry as a whole.
In this case, with your example, actually, if he breeds 100 mares, it's typically stud fee paid on live foal. Conservative figures are 80%, but many farms run calculations based upon 90% (depending on how he tested). So you have 80 to 90 paid stud fees.....if everyone pays, LOL. Also, don't forget the so called "year one" is not today, LOL. When the mares foal, they are weanlings, next year yearlings, and then the next year they hopefully hit the track as 2yo's. How they look, sell, and race.....each step gets you closer to success or failure, LOL.
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In this case, with your example, actually, if he breeds 100 mares, it's typically stud fee paid on live foal. Conservative figures are 80%, but many farms run calculations based upon 90% (depending on how he tested). So you have 80 to 90 paid stud fees.....if everyone pays, LOL.
I think your conservative figure of 80% is way to generous.
You tell me what stud gets over 80%, and I will look it up.
I can't tell you paid fees, but I can easily look up number of registered foals.
example
Sweet Lou
year 2020 bred 140 mares
resulting regestrations 93
66.42%
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Some offspring name suggestions...
Little Boner
Big Boner
She Likes Boners
Bonissimo / Bonissima Boners ngc3
Another classy post by the top loser of Horseplop.
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valid points for sure
whatever the actual% of live foals is i think the numbers still lean in favor of the stallion money
but the reality is they cant all succeed
if you don't have a major farm behind the stallion you just don't get enough quality mares, there is just not enough of them around
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Hard to tell which are actual breeding stock (both male and female), and which are chemically enhanced. Lots that were juiced to the gills have failed as stallions.
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I think your conservative figure of 80% is way to generous.
You tell me what stud gets over 80%, and I will look it up.
I can't tell you paid fees, but I can easily look up number of registered foals.
example
Sweet Lou
year 2020 bred 140 mares
resulting regestrations 93
66.42%
I was referring to what farms project. Probably what they show their bank, LOL. I know the #'s are less than 80%, but I think farms pad numbers, yes, for the bank, and possibly when syndicating stallions and future payments to owners. That's why a lot of owners were owed money from various farms. Joe McCluskey was owed a fortune by Kentuckiana because he bought into their numbers. Some owners got smart after hearing and seeing the horror stories, LOL.