HORSEPLOP.COM
General Category => Harness Racing => Topic started by: Mailbox Money on November 10, 2023, 08:50:24 PM
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Don't toss the remote too far when your parlay falls apart in the last minute of the game,because you may want to see Jeffy G.on 60 minutes! It should be very interesting to see how they portray the doping scandal. Could be the highlight of the day! CBS at 7pm!
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The task of cleaning up the issue of Performance Enhancing Drugs (PED) in the sport of horse racing has proven to be a daunting task. Meadowlands Racetrack owner Jeff Gural has led the charge to eradicate PEDs and continues to be diligent on the topic.Gural will appear on CBS' 60 Minutes this Sunday, Nov. 12 during one of the three segments on the 25-time Peabody Award-winning newsmagazine. The piece on racing, titled ‘Horse Racing Reform?’, is a segment that includes a look back at the investigation that led to the arrest and conviction of dozens of horse trainers, veterinarians and drug distributors. Correspondent Cecilia Vega examines the wiretaps that helped solve the case, while Horseracing Integrity and Safety Authority (HISA) Chief Executive Officer Lisa Lazarus, the woman heading up the new national regulator tasked with cleaning up horse racing, sits down with Vega to discuss the moment of reckoning and the sport’s future.
This episode will air on Sunday, Nov. 12 at 7 p.m.
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I don’t know about you guys but I certainly thank the KING JEW for his contributions harness racing! Good man
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I don’t know about you guys but I certainly thank the KING JEW for his contributions harness racing! Good man
You are one of the bigger douchebags on this forum and that is quite an accomplishment! tmbz1
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You are one of the bigger douchebags on this forum and that is quite an accomplishment! tmbz1
GAYGOOTS is not a douchebag, He's a human DILDO.
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You idiots can't see the forest for the trees but then again most of you are just degenerate gamblers.
It's great that the KING JEW is taking it out of the government hands and acting like a mafia maybe we'll finally get some law and order into this corrupt game of ours!
Look what happened when that fucking dummy Giuliani busted up the mob... now look what you have a fucking soul city run by a bunch of BLM black gangsters!!
I don't expect most of you to comprehend what I'm saying since most of you're faces in a program looking for the next one to five shot that runs out of the money
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https://twitter.com/60Minutes/status/1723003421505020034?s=20
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You idiots can't see the forest for the trees but then again most of you are just degenerate gamblers.
It's great that the KING JEW is taking it out of the government hands and acting like a mafia maybe we'll finally get some law and order into this corrupt game of ours!
Look what happened when that fucking dummy Giuliani busted up the mob... now look what you have a fucking soul city run by a bunch of BLM black gangsters!!
I don't expect most of you to comprehend what I'm saying since most of you're faces in a program looking for the next one to five shot that runs out of the money
Why do you need to refer to him by his religious affiliation? Cant you just use his real name? You are worse than Mike Ant.
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Why do you need to refer to him by his religious affiliation? Cant you just use his real name? You are worse than Mike Ant.
Guy is a racist loser! SCM says he lives in his brother's basement.
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I don't agree with Gural all the time. In this case who else is trying to clean up the sport? I'll give Jeff credit for taking on this monumental task. He has more money than he could spend, is old, & doesn't need the headache.
My question is why he's done it? Some will say ego...but he's not a nobody.
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https://harnessracingupdate.com/2023/11/11/gural-explains-what-we-can-expect-from-his-appearance-on-60-minutes/
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I don't agree with Gural all the time. In this case who else is trying to clean up the sport? I'll give Jeff credit for taking on this monumental task. He has more money than he could spend, is old, & doesn't need the headache.
My question is why he's done it? Some will say ego...but he's not a nobody.
Why does Gural care so much you ask? Here is my take on it all. If you were a witness to the Jeff Gural that used to spend his summers with his wife in a bungalow in the Catskills, you knew about his love of harness racing. This was before he took over his father’s business and grew it into the real estate powerhouse he has today. He was a passionate fan who went at night to Monticello Raceway and yelled at the drivers associated with his losing tickets. In other words he was just a fan like so many of us in the heyday of harness racing. Fast forward to when the Meadowlands was facing extinction when Gural rescued the track from becoming just another mall with offices and condos. So the same guy who used to yell at the drivers and C-3 horses, that were going in 2:10 at MR on a beautiful summer night, now had the opportunity to build something special. And he wanted his track to be clean which included the trainers and drivers. Now he is in his 80s and still hoping to rescue a dirty industry into what we all loved in the 60s and 70s. It is called passion and I for one admire and appreciate all his efforts.
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Why does Gural care so much you ask? Here is my take on it all. If you were a witness to the Jeff Gural that used to spend his summers with his wife in a bungalow in the Catskills, you knew about his love of harness racing. This was before he took over his father’s business and grew it into the real estate powerhouse he has today. He was a passionate fan who went at night to Monticello Raceway and yelled at the drivers associated with his losing tickets. In other words he was just a fan like so many of us in the heyday of harness racing. Fast forward to when the Meadowlands was facing extinction when Gural rescued the track from becoming just another mall with offices and condos. So the same guy who used to yell at the drivers and C-3 horses, that were going in 2:10 at MR on a beautiful summer night, now had the opportunity to build something special. And he wanted his track to be clean which included the trainers and drivers. Now he is in his 80s and still hoping to rescue a dirty industry into what we all loved in the 60s and 70s. It is called passion and I for one admire and appreciate all his efforts.
Well said.
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tmbz1
Why does Gural care so much you ask? Here is my take on it all. If you were a witness to the Jeff Gural that used to spend his summers with his wife in a bungalow in the Catskills, you knew about his love of harness racing. This was before he took over his father’s business and grew it into the real estate powerhouse he has today. He was a passionate fan who went at night to Monticello Raceway and yelled at the drivers associated with his losing tickets. In other words he was just a fan like so many of us in the heyday of harness racing. Fast forward to when the Meadowlands was facing extinction when Gural rescued the track from becoming just another mall with offices and condos. So the same guy who used to yell at the drivers and C-3 horses, that were going in 2:10 at MR on a beautiful summer night, now had the opportunity to build something special. And he wanted his track to be clean which included the trainers and drivers. Now he is in his 80s and still hoping to rescue a dirty industry into what we all loved in the 60s and 70s. It is called passion and I for one admire and appreciate all his efforts.
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I wonder if Gural's employees in the RACING OFFICE have the same type of transparency as he does........Their hidden ownerships with trainers on Gural's exclusion list.......
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If you have the scoop, by all means serve it up.
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Jeff Gural did all he has done so he could get a casino at the swamp.
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I didnt a long line of people willing to step up and save racing at the Big M.
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If you have the scoop, by all means serve it up.
Longtime knowledge (still ongoing) on the street of RACING OFFICE staff having hidden ownership with exclusion list participants..... ...this is not a scoop............ ...just more hypocritical crap flourishing in the industry right under GURAL's nose
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Why does Gural care so much you ask? Here is my take on it all. If you were a witness to the Jeff Gural that used to spend his summers with his wife in a bungalow in the Catskills, you knew about his love of harness racing. This was before he took over his father’s business and grew it into the real estate powerhouse he has today. He was a passionate fan who went at night to Monticello Raceway and yelled at the drivers associated with his losing tickets. In other words he was just a fan like so many of us in the heyday of harness racing. Fast forward to when the Meadowlands was facing extinction when Gural rescued the track from becoming just another mall with offices and condos. So the same guy who used to yell at the drivers and C-3 horses, that were going in 2:10 at MR on a beautiful summer night, now had the opportunity to build something special. And he wanted his track to be clean which included the trainers and drivers. Now he is in his 80s and still hoping to rescue a dirty industry into what we all loved in the 60s and 70s. It is called passion and I for one admire and appreciate all his efforts.
tmbz1 tmbz1
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Why does Gural care so much you ask? Here is my take on it all. If you were a witness to the Jeff Gural that used to spend his summers with his wife in a bungalow in the Catskills, you knew about his love of harness racing. This was before he took over his father’s business and grew it into the real estate powerhouse he has today. He was a passionate fan who went at night to Monticello Raceway and yelled at the drivers associated with his losing tickets. In other words he was just a fan like so many of us in the heyday of harness racing. Fast forward to when the Meadowlands was facing extinction when Gural rescued the track from becoming just another mall with offices and condos. So the same guy who used to yell at the drivers and C-3 horses, that were going in 2:10 at MR on a beautiful summer night, now had the opportunity to build something special. And he wanted his track to be clean which included the trainers and drivers. Now he is in his 80s and still hoping to rescue a dirty industry into what we all loved in the 60s and 70s. It is called passion and I for one admire and appreciate all his efforts.
This is nonsense. The father Aaron gural was the one who created that business powerhouse in NYC
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This is nonsense. The father Aaron gural was the one who created that business powerhouse in NYC
So that’s what you took from my post? You want to debate whether Jeff or his father impacted their business the most? Why didn’t you add Jeff’s son too. Do you think anyone one reading your nonsense gives a crap which Gural had the biggest impact on their real estate business? Go back to sleep buddy,
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So that’s what you took from my post? You want to debate whether Jeff or his father impacted their business the most? Why didn’t you add Jeff’s son too. Do you think anyone one reading your nonsense gives a crap which Gural had the biggest impact on their real estate business? Go back to sleep buddy,
If it was irrelevant, why did you mention it?
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So that’s what you took from my post? You want to debate whether Jeff or his father impacted their business the most? Why didn’t you add Jeff’s son too. Do you think anyone one reading your nonsense gives a crap which Gural had the biggest impact on their real estate business? Go back to sleep buddy,
I do not want to debate anything. You painted a bullshit story about Jeff's low country bungalow lifestyle and turning the business into a powerhouse. This is no debate. Aaron was the powerhouse of Newmark
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Why does Gural care so much you ask? Here is my take on it all. If you were a witness to the Jeff Gural that used to spend his summers with his wife in a bungalow in the Catskills, you knew about his love of harness racing. This was before he took over his father’s business and grew it into the real estate powerhouse he has today. He was a passionate fan who went at night to Monticello Raceway and yelled at the drivers associated with his losing tickets. In other words he was just a fan like so many of us in the heyday of harness racing. Fast forward to when the Meadowlands was facing extinction when Gural rescued the track from becoming just another mall with offices and condos. So the same guy who used to yell at the drivers and C-3 horses, that were going in 2:10 at MR on a beautiful summer night, now had the opportunity to build something special. And he wanted his track to be clean which included the trainers and drivers. Now he is in his 80s and still hoping to rescue a dirty industry into what we all loved in the 60s and 70s. It is called passion and I for one admire and appreciate all his efforts.
I agree. As far as his motivations, I don't care that he is profit motivated. He's supposed to be. He's an entrepreneur, a capitalist, and so am I, LOL. He puts capital at risk, he is supposed to be motivated and make decisions to get an ROI. People have long said he just wants a casino. Good for him, give it to him! He is supposed to want a casino. I too do not agree with everything he's done. However, he's done more than anyone else in the sport and in the business. Period.
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Gural saved the Meadowlands and built the best harness racing facility in America. Then he declares war on all the cheaters when organizations like the USTA and HRU do nothing, say nothing, write nothing. But we have people like pocketwinner that rather zero in on stupid stuff instead of recognizing all the good Gural has done. For goodness sake he has saved hundreds of jobs and given local fans a great venue for racing and sports betting. Who else has done anything close?
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I wonder if Gural's employees in the RACING OFFICE have the same type of transparency as he does........Their hidden ownerships with trainers on Gural's exclusion list.......
Report
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Gural stepped up when Christie tried to bury New Jersey racing. How anyone who claims to be a harness fan would hate the very person who saved it in the state of New Jersey, and does the largest NIGHT TIME handle of ALL North AMERICAN tracks, is ridiculous.
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I agree. As far as his motivations, I don't care that he is profit motivated. He's supposed to be. He's an entrepreneur, a capitalist, and so am I, LOL. He puts capital at risk, he is supposed to be motivated and make decisions to get an ROI. People have long said he just wants a casino. Good for him, give it to him! He is supposed to want a casino. I too do not agree with everything he's done. However, he's done more than anyone else in the sport and in the business. Period.
Speaking of yourself, a capitalist, I am wondering. If one of your ventures fails, do you also choose to beg for welfare bailout money like Gural?
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The entire industry is begging for a lifeline. What are you talking about now?
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The entire industry is begging for a lifeline. What are you talking about now?
No. The rest of the industry is bound by contract to receive those % of revenue for purses. Comversely, Gural took a shot to get a casino, he failed, and ever since has begged for state bailout welfare money.
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I do not want to debate anything. You painted a bullshit story about Jeff's low country bungalow lifestyle and turning the business into a powerhouse. This is no debate. Aaron was the powerhouse of Newmark
Agreed content btw Gural has not been with Newmark in ANY Capacity for sometime. He started his own group, (GFP Real Estate).
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Nothing new on 60 Minutes except millions of people who weren’t aware of all the doping do now. Can’t help.
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Girl doing the interview is HOT
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Girl doing the interview is HOT
ngc3 ngc3 ngc3
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https://www.cbsnews.com/news/horse-racing-anti-doping-racetrack-safety-60-minutes-transcript/
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If the investigation is "winding down" then they have failed
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The very little emphasis on the Harness end of the scandal is classified as "a close call"in my book.We all know that they could have done an entire hour on the topic! Take your seat belts off,the crash isn't going to happen!
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all the breakdowns mentioned horses at thoroughbred tracks. When they did mention harness racing, they said it's"horses pulling carts". Like most people have never heard of this type of racing. Which is the case.
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AI saw the segment as a very slanted view of horse racing. Without saying so, they tied the rash of deaths to horses racing and training to drugs.
It looked more like a calculated attempt to sway the uninformed to form a political view of all horse racing, as a willing sacrifice of the magnificent animals for greed of the rich and entitled. It made racing look cruel and archaic in a modern and progressive society.
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well stated
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AI saw the segment as a very slanted view of horse racing. Without saying so, they tied the rash of deaths to horses racing and training to drugs.
It looked more like a calculated attempt to sway the uninformed to form a political view of all horse racing, as a willing sacrifice of the magnificent animals for greed of the rich and entitled. It made racing look cruel and archaic in a modern and progressive society.
Well said
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Girl doing the interview is HOT
Cecelia Vega, formerly on ABC so-called news division: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7gIEU3ZasZc
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AI saw the segment as a very slanted view of horse racing. Without saying so, they tied the rash of deaths to horses racing and training to drugs.
It looked more like a calculated attempt to sway the uninformed to form a political view of all horse racing, as a willing sacrifice of the magnificent animals for greed of the rich and entitled. It made racing look cruel and archaic in a modern and progressive society.
A modern and 'progressive' (more like REGRESSIVE) society that also embraces UFC fighting where men and women beat their brains out. Same society that hates cigarette and cigar second hand smoke but loves the aroma and detrimental effects of marijuana?
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(https://i.ibb.co/B3nvGTn/Image1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bmbYFNb)
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(https://i.ibb.co/B3nvGTn/Image1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bmbYFNb)
I wonder how these POS are liking prison
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I wonder how these POS are liking prison
NO TRUER STATEMENT HAS EVER BEEN MADE THAN..."A Picture is worth a thousand words."
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Perhaps, I should remind the Plop Viewers that Julie Miller and Nick Surick were "partners" on a TB, trained by Navarro. Fact. But still the most resounding "We didnt know what was going on". is Michele Crawford, who took good horses from other trainers and moved them Not only to Surick and Oaks, But moved their TB's to Servus and Navarro. C'mon you really didnt know??? ngc3
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The handouts can end with a vote and a signature. PA has tried to do this a few times. Since 95% of the voters could care less about racing, the handouts will be eliminated. It is just a case of when.
Fortunately no state legislature has wanted to put a bullet in the agricultural sector and killed off lots of green space that would otherwise be developed
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all the breakdowns mentioned horses at thoroughbred tracks. When they did mention harness racing, they said it's"horses pulling carts". Like most people have never heard of this type of racing. Which is the case.
They called it a niche sport. True, but had to laugh- that’s a new one.
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The entire industry is begging for a lifeline. What are you talking about now?
Lets be real here. Just for a moment. There is a thing called "Market Saturation" Vegas and AC were the only legit gambling venues, except for a few outside the country. However, with the greed of tax legislation to prop up failing state economy's, some state governments operating at or near bankruptcy themselves. They came up with the quick fix. Allow racino and casino licensing at multiple millions of dollars per license, and a taxable base that would seemingly solve state government issues and short falls. That worked for a while, and kept money inside the state that was otherwise going to Vegas and AC. The problem is a quick fix, and bandaids are never long term plans for recovery. You are now all witnessing the result of bandaids to a wound that needed sutures. Drive an hour from AC you have 5 casinos in Phila. market a way smaller city the NYC. Not mention the Delaware venues also not far away.
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As we discuss our failing industry and its history, I always come back to one reason the industry is going down. Like many interests before technology harness racing was a go there live event. Even in the colder months I had a blast with my friends and strangers discussing all the sights and sounds of a track. I even got excited entering Yonkers Raceway back in the 60s and 70s. But going to secondary tracks in the warmer months like Monticello, Saratoga, Brandywine, Green Mountain were just great times. But once casinos, lotteries and online gambling hit harness racing the steep decline began. Sure the cheating also hurt but cheating hasn’t hurt live events like baseball and football where there were everything from steroids to deflated footballs.Add the fact that younger people want non-stop action and low, low take-outs well harness racing just doesn’t fit. In my opinion the feds can jail all the cheaters they find but in the end it won’t matter to the younger fans. They have already moved on and we older fans will just fade away.
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When Surick started out at Freehold winning a lot we all knew what was going on. They try to change 'one molecule' on a drug and inject it into a horse where there is no current test to nail the trainer. These guys should NEVER be reinstated as they were lowlives to begin with. These drug inducing so-called trainers could not pronounce the very liquid's chemical name they were injecting into their horses. It is disgusting what these guys all did, and are STILL doing, via new concoctions the chemists are coming up with. Training is not rocket science. It is a basic thing to do. A level playing field is the goal, if it can ever be achieved. The owners that employ these rodents, and the breeding farms that champion their drug induced stallions, should be ashamed of themselves. Gural was correct saying a trainer cannot improve a horse by 2 seconds, or 10 lengths, without illegal substances being involved. How many "top" trainers RIGHT NOW are using untestable drugs? We will never know.
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During last night's episode the need for HISA was discussed at great lengths because of the need for FEDERAL government to become involved in the rules and regulations and testing of the SPORT of KINGS........It rang so clear to me when the people being interviewed said that the "STATES" had failed in their effort to police the tracks.........fa ilure truly came from inadequate State RACING COMMISSIONS(appointed by Governors of each state),inadequate judges(just getting a pay check ,and inadequate labs running the so-called tests...........
but does any of the abuse and drug usage slow up.....apparently not.......
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I wonder if Nicky boy and his fellow inmates sat and watched 60 mins? Knowing Nick I’m sure when they played his wiretap he was laughing, thinking he’s cool cat. On the other hand if Navarro was watching it he was fuming lol. Good for all these POS garbage cans.
Nicky probably needs to worry about an a$$ beating when he gets out. If he has an a$$ to beat.
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Speaking of yourself, a capitalist, I am wondering. If one of your ventures fails, do you also choose to beg for welfare bailout money like Gural?
What welfare bailout money are you referring to? Monmouth Park didn't get welfare bailout money. They got paid to NOT put VLT's at their racetrack. If a racetrack leases out space to a casino company for VLT's, slot machines, or a casino, is that welfare bailout money? I see it as a revenue source. If a casino, or anyone for that matter, wants to pay a track to NOT put in alternative gaming, that's not welfare bailout money, that's business. The moment decoupling is legal, a casino company that owns a racetrack will close that side of the facility. It's business. Highest and best use.
As far as what I get if a venture fails, I will take whatever benefit is legal and offered to me. Tax deduction, credit, write-down, or even a benefit, like if I invest in a QOZ. Whatever I am entitled to, I will take it. That's what a capitalist does. Now if that money is optional and being redeployed from elsewhere, then I have a decision to make.
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What welfare bailout money are you referring to? Monmouth Park didn't get welfare bailout money. They got paid to NOT put VLT's at their racetrack. If a racetrack leases out space to a casino company for VLT's, slot machines, or a casino, is that welfare bailout money? I see it as a revenue source. If a casino, or anyone for that matter, wants to pay a track to NOT put in alternative gaming, that's not welfare bailout money, that's business. The moment decoupling is legal, a casino company that owns a racetrack will close that side of the facility. It's business. Highest and best use.
As far as what I get if a venture fails, I will take whatever benefit is legal and offered to me. Tax deduction, credit, write-down, or even a benefit, like if I invest in a QOZ. Whatever I am entitled to, I will take it. That's what a capitalist does. Now if that money is optional and being redeployed from elsewhere, then I have a decision to make.
I am talking about recent subsidy. The one you referenced is about 15 years old, Christie put away with it when AC tumbled mod 2000s. I am talking the subsidy Gural begs for every year. The official reason for it is to retain jobs and make the industry more competitive with tracks in neighboring states.
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Always thought about this
When Surick's seat got its hottest, did his regular Freehold driver's name ever get mentioned?
I mean..if the instructions day after day, week after week, horse after horse, is to blast to the front, no worse than second, basically a pattern is established. A breakneck, heartpoundung 1/4 mile pattern.
Were servis or navarros top jocks or Suricks Freehold front ender ever questioned quietly by authorities what they might of surmised OR is it 100000000% a trainer problem?
Dont a top Freehold driver or t'bred jocks understand 'a pattern of instructions' could be problematic with similar scripts for many horses put under them or in front of them under harness.
And I know answer to this is no but: are they ever liable as the animal's chauffeur for overhearing or interpreting instructions and not reporting strange patterned instruction to track management?
I know we're living in an alternate universe to think any of that possible. But perhaps small suspensions or fines should start being levied against drivers or jocks if a trainer is suspended, maybe 10% of trainer's penalty, if there's proof they knowingly drove the animal with drugs in its system..I guess youd have to start adding a lie detector to the sample stall...i dont think thats gonna happen.
But these are dangerous times..the game and its future teetering...no idea can get tossed easily.
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Perhaps, I should remind the Plop Viewers that Julie Miller and Nick Surick were "partners" on a TB, trained by Navarro. Fact. But still the most resounding "We didnt know what was going on". is Michele Crawford, who took good horses from other trainers and moved them Not only to Surick and Oaks, But moved their TB's to Servus and Navarro. C'mon you really didnt know??? ngc3
Unless her brain matter was used instead of silicone for those fake titties she absolutely knew
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Unless her brain matter was used instead of silicone for those fake titties she absolutely knew
We can review her trainer stats and draw conclusions. During the height of the navarro/servis/surick run ('18-'21), she was a 19% - 20% super trainer. Since 2022, 12%
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Great stat. That says it all doesn’t it?
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https://pastthewire.com/15-minutes-of-ugly-on-60-minutes/#comment-14169
"Of greater concern is the ongoing incompetence of state regulators and racetracks at effectively policing the sport. Miniscule fines and suspensions offer little deterrent for racing infractions. More serious cases are NEVER referred to law enforcement for criminal prosecution under felony animal cruelty or felony tampering (race fixing) laws. Racing regulators are incestuously linked to the regulated and they strive to provide the veneer of competent oversight. They have and continue to fail in their mandate."
From the 60 Min segment:
The Jockey Club’s Stewart Janney also spoke with Vega.
“How big of a problem is doping in horse racing?” asked Vega.
“It’s a big problem,” responded Janney.
“It strikes at the integrity of the sport. It’s not good for the horses. There’s just nothing about it that’s acceptable,” he added.
“What has horse racing regulation been like over the last 50 years?” asked Vega.
“A failure,” Janney emphatically said.
“Increasingly so,” he added.
“It’s gotten worse.” commented Vega.
“It’s gotten worse. And, quite frankly, states have not done their job,” Janney added.
Vega remarked: “When you talk about something that’s sounds like it’s as institutionalized as corruption has been, I don’t know how you clean that up.”
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Great stat. That says it all doesn’t it?
Yet Gural will continue to allow the Millers to function at his tracks, why, because they train Gural horses. So if 60 minutes wanted an expose there is one to scratch the surface.
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They called it a niche sport. True, but had to laugh- that’s a new one.
What do you mean new one? That is and what has been the sport forever. Only one sport of kings and that is the thoroughbred. Harness has no handle to keep the sport alive much less thrive. If it's not a major day of racing very little fanfare at the track. Even brick and mortar facilities are empty. ADW all but killed the way to go and watch when you can do it hand. Which also is the lowest form of % back to the purse account. 99% of America has no clue what harness racing is where it takes place and when it takes place.
State legislation easily can rewrite and decouple away the partnerships with casinos. In PA they will sue when they lose and its written they will receive 1 yr of the benefit they currently get. If that number is still 250M they will have to make that really stretch meaning a lot more dark days and breeders awards good luck with that one.
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What welfare bailout money are you referring to? Monmouth Park didn't get welfare bailout money. They got paid to NOT put VLT's at their racetrack. If a racetrack leases out space to a casino company for VLT's, slot machines, or a casino, is that welfare bailout money? I see it as a revenue source. If a casino, or anyone for that matter, wants to pay a track to NOT put in alternative gaming, that's not welfare bailout money, that's business. The moment decoupling is legal, a casino company that owns a racetrack will close that side of the facility. It's business. Highest and best use.
As far as what I get if a venture fails, I will take whatever benefit is legal and offered to me. Tax deduction, credit, write-down, or even a benefit, like if I invest in a QOZ. Whatever I am entitled to, I will take it. That's what a capitalist does. Now if that money is optional and being redeployed from elsewhere, then I have a decision to make.
Yes there is a much newer tax payer handout for both thoroughbred and harness in NJ. 3-years ago maybe? Part of that deal the Meadowlands had to show handle growth during this period of time. Not sure where this subsidy stands today but they where definitely receiving millions. Believe Monmouth had the better end of the deal?
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The day will come. The voters could care less about racing especially harness racing. The handouts could pay for roads, and bridges, and schools with less tax increases. PA has been close to doing this several times. The day will come. After that decoupling will be next. Ask yourself, if the handouts were put on the ballot, what would be the outcome?
As a fan, I want to see the handouts end. Then the industry will have to offer a product people actually want to see and will support.
It does not kill off the "agricultural sector" just racing. Maybe the price of food would come down as more land is available for the real "agricultural sector".
https://edvoterspa.org/race-horse-development-fund/#:~:text=The%20Race%20Horse%20Development%20Fund,wealthy%20horseracing%20enthusiasts%20and%20hobbyists.
http://www.kidsoverhorseracing.org/
If it was that easy all Philly high school students would be looking at free college, horse racing would be dead in PA and Wolf would still be governor
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The day will come. The voters could care less about racing especially harness racing. The handouts could pay for roads, and bridges, and schools with less tax increases. PA has been close to doing this several times. The day will come. After that decoupling will be next. Ask yourself, if the handouts were put on the ballot, what would be the outcome?
As a fan, I want to see the handouts end. Then the industry will have to offer a product people actually want to see and will support.
It does not kill off the "agricultural sector" just racing. Maybe the price of food would come down as more land is available for the real "agricultural sector".
https://edvoterspa.org/race-horse-development-fund/#:~:text=The%20Race%20Horse%20Development%20Fund,wealthy%20horseracing%20enthusiasts%20and%20hobbyists.
http://www.kidsoverhorseracing.org/
The " kids over racing" link above says it all.
Why in the world is Pocono Downs and Harrahs Philadelphia still racing while schools cannot afford computers, musical instruments, athletic supplies and uniforms, decent lunches, etc.
Instead we see these juicer trainers and complicit owners raking in obscene purses while nobody bets these tracks because proven scumbage like Dean Eckley, Gareth Dowth. Marc Mosher, Darren Tanneyhill, and so on and so on stealing this money.
Enough
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Always thought about this
When Surick's seat got its hottest, did his regular Freehold driver's name ever get mentioned?
I mean..if the instructions day after day, week after week, horse after horse, is to blast to the front, no worse than second, basically a pattern is established. A breakneck, heartpoundung 1/4 mile pattern.
Were servis or navarros top jocks or Suricks Freehold front ender ever questioned quietly by authorities what they might of surmised OR is it 100000000% a trainer problem?
Dont a top Freehold driver or t'bred jocks understand 'a pattern of instructions' could be problematic with similar scripts for many horses put under them or in front of them under harness.
And I know answer to this is no but: are they ever liable as the animal's chauffeur for overhearing or interpreting instructions and not reporting strange patterned instruction to track management?
I know we're living in an alternate universe to think any of that possible. But perhaps small suspensions or fines should start being levied against drivers or jocks if a trainer is suspended, maybe 10% of trainer's penalty, if there's proof they knowingly drove the animal with drugs in its system..I guess youd have to start adding a lie detector to the sample stall...i dont think thats gonna happen.
But these are dangerous times..the game and its future teetering...no idea can get tossed easily.
Andy Miller was basically Suricks only driver at Freehold. Believe me he knew when the horses were juices and when they were not. He got NO accolades from me for his recent milestone wins. Another POS!
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The " kids over racing" link above says it all.
Why in the world is Pocono Downs and Harrahs Philadelphia still racing while schools cannot afford computers, musical instruments, athletic supplies and uniforms, decent lunches, etc.
Instead we see these juicer trainers and complicit owners raking in obscene purses while nobody bets these tracks because proven scumbage like Dean Eckley, Gareth Dowth. Marc Mosher, Darren Tanneyhill, and so on and so on stealing this money.
Enough
Better question is. Where are the billions PA already gets from their portion of the casinos????
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Better question is. Where are the billions PA already gets from their portion of the casinos????
Easy the Breeders, trainers retirement fund, new paddocks at the track, obviously the built up of purses daily and stake program that for 15 plus years has seen money leave the state. Hanover Farms, Ron Burke, and Takter owners kindly thank the casino partnership
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Easy the Breeders, trainers retirement fund, new paddocks at the track, obviously the built up of purses daily and stake program that for 15 plus years has seen money leave the state. Hanover Farms, Ron Burke, and Takter owners kindly thank the casino partnership
You are talking about the racing percentages. I’m talking about the PA government % they get every year from each casino. That was supposed to lower taxes and build better schools
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Only one sport of kings and that is the thoroughbred.
This is true. Gural emphatically proclaimed we are the sport of queens.
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You are talking about the racing percentages. I’m talking about the PA government % they get every year from each casino. That was supposed to lower taxes and build better schools
Yes you are right to keep the taxes lower. Wasn't sure about building better schools but if those funds go into the general fund we'll like most states that run budget deficits it goes into the blackhole abyss and later spent elsewhere or lining pockets of lobbyist.
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Andy Miller was basically Suricks only driver at Freehold. Believe me he knew when the horses were juices and when they were not. He got NO accolades from me for his recent milestone wins. Another POS!
SUPPOSEDLY ANY, JULIE AND ERV NAMES WILL BE RELEASED ANY DAY BY THE FEDS. GURAL CAN KEEP PROTECTING THEM BUT ONCE THE FEDS GOT INVOLVED NOBODY WWAS SAFE. THEIR DAY IS COMING.
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SUPPOSEDLY ANY, JULIE AND ERV NAMES WILL BE RELEASED ANY DAY BY THE FEDS. GURAL CAN KEEP PROTECTING THEM BUT ONCE THE FEDS GOT INVOLVED NOBODY WWAS SAFE. THEIR DAY IS COMING.
Maybe the Feds were players at some of the Swingers parties the Millers threw.
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Maybe the Feds were players at some of the Swingers parties the Millers threw.
those were good times. watching julie going down on chics
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Why does Gural care so much you ask? Here is my take on it all. If you were a witness to the Jeff Gural that used to spend his summers with his wife in a bungalow in the Catskills, you knew about his love of harness racing. This was before he took over his father’s business and grew it into the real estate powerhouse he has today. He was a passionate fan who went at night to Monticello Raceway and yelled at the drivers associated with his losing tickets. In other words he was just a fan like so many of us in the heyday of harness racing. Fast forward to when the Meadowlands was facing extinction when Gural rescued the track from becoming just another mall with offices and condos. So the same guy who used to yell at the drivers and C-3 horses, that were going in 2:10 at MR on a beautiful summer night, now had the opportunity to build something special. And he wanted his track to be clean which included the trainers and drivers. Now he is in his 80s and still hoping to rescue a dirty industry into what we all loved in the 60s and 70s. It is called passion and I for one admire and appreciate all his efforts.
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