HORSEPLOP.COM
General Category => Harness Racing => Topic started by: swoodall on November 30, 2018, 04:51:43 PM
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Ohio racetrack vets offer thoughts on out of competition testing
Columbus, OH – A quintet of Ohio-based, practicing racetrack veterinarians provided the Ohio State Racing Commission members with their thoughts on out of competition testing at the OSRC’s monthly meeting, Thursday (Nov. 29) in Columbus, OH.
The veterinarians, who among them have more than 150 years of experience, included: Dr. John Piehowicz, Cincinnati (Thoroughbreds/Standardbreds); Dr. John Reichert, Grove City (Standardbreds); Dr. Barry Carter, Lancaster, (Standardbreds); Dr. Dan Wilson, Cleveland, (Standardbreds); and Dr. Scott Shell, Cleveland (Thoroughbreds).
All five veterinarians agreed that clients in their respective practices were in favor of out of competition testing in the Buckeye State.
“We need to establish a simple process, whereas a public training center or private farm would be able to be easily licensed by the OSRC,” Dr. Barry Carter stated. “By being licensed, it would allow the OSRC to walk onto a property at any time and test and/or examine any racehorse.
“The race secretaries would only accept horses from licensed facilities,” Dr. Carter added. “And the licensing fees should be nominal, so everyone would be encouraged to get licensed.”
“My major concern is, what will we test for?” said Dr. Dan Wilson. “The RCI protocol is currently burdensome and we need to narrow the focus of testing and test for street designer drugs such as neuro-toxins, blood doping agents and venoms.
“Also, we’ll have to deal with horses coming in from neighboring states such as Michigan and New York. At Northfield (Park), we have a ton of horses coming from these areas every night and have anywhere from 640 to 740 horses stabled on the grounds.”
“Out of competition testing will eliminate the ‘shooting star’ trainers, as well as the gossip and innuendoes that are a backstretch constant,” Dr. John Piehowicz acknowledged. “Out of competition testing also serves as a strong deterrent to those few bad apples we have in the racing industry.
“Racing is a privilege, just like driving, and protocol will need to be set well in advance,” Dr. Piehowicz continued. “We’re going to need to establish who does the testing. What criteria is that person going to have to be authorized to test horses? What about out of state competitors? How do we handle them? We’re going to have to work closely in cooperation with surrounding states.
“The penalties need to be stiff too—ten or 15-year suspensions or a life ban for medications that are injurious to the welfare of the horse,” Dr. Piehowicz stressed. “This year at Belterra Park we had 900 horses on the grounds and 30 to 40 percent of those on race day are ship-ins, so a slap on the wrist for a drug that has no business being in a horse’s system isn’t appropriate.”
“I’m firmly in favor of out of competition testing but the RCI model as it currently stands is just way too large,” said Dr. Scott Shell. “There are drugs out there right now that have no business being in a horse: venoms, toxics and blood-doping agents like synthetic EPO. However, there are a lot of drugs on the RCI list that we use as healing agents and we need to narrow the scope to those harmful agents.
“Out of competition testing will also help to eliminate excess testing expenses,” Dr. Shell continued. “In order for me to keep my veterinarian license, I’m required to be accountable for every drop of medication that goes into every horse and when and where I performed that service. Therefore, a trainer needs to be able to produce a vet record of his or her horses so that regulators have a clear idea of what is therapeutic and what isn’t.
“For instance, anabolic steroids are a controlled substance that we, as veterinarians, use therapeutically, and we need to establish the difference between when medications are used therapeutically and when they are not.”
“Out of competition testing has become a necessity,” Dr. John Reichert admitted. “The majority of trainers are operating within the rules, but because of the few bad apples we need out of competition testing and we need to establish accurate testing. I’m talking about agents that have long term effects on a horse’s system: blood doping, venoms, etc. We need an effective narrow scope of testing, and the accuracy of testing is paramount to establishing severe penalties for the cheaters.
“We also need to think about legal concerns,” Dr. Reichert continued. “For instance, do we do random testing, or do we pick the obvious cheaters? There’s not many trainers who operate on a 400 to 600-win average. But we’re also going to have to think about horses that throw in bad races for reasons such as flipped-palates and tying up, and then dramatically improve when in the hands of a new trainer who can help alleviate those issues.
“I also think that logistically we’ll have to figure out how we’re going to cooperate amongst the other states who already have out of competition testing in place,” Dr. Reichert noted. “For instance, different states have different testing procedures. Are we going to test the horses in the state they’re currently in or do we bring them to a central location? The manpower to do the testing has to be credentialed and capable as well.”
“In my opinion, out of competition testing is the biggest deterrent to illicit drug use in this industry,” Dr. Barry Carter concluded.
“Obviously, out of competition is a multi-faceted issue which needs to be discussed further,” stated Robert Schmitz, OSRC chairman. “At our January 2019 meeting, I’m asking the Ohio Department of Agriculture’s testing lab to be on hand to lend their insight into this issue.”
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Ohio racetrack vets offer thoughts on out of competition testing
Columbus, OH – A quintet of Ohio-based, practicing racetrack veterinarians provided the Ohio State Racing Commission members with their thoughts on out of competition testing at the OSRC’s monthly meeting, Thursday (Nov. 29) in Columbus, OH.
The veterinarians, who among them have more than 150 years of experience, included: Dr. John Piehowicz, Cincinnati (Thoroughbreds/Standardbreds); Dr. John Reichert, Grove City (Standardbreds); Dr. Barry Carter, Lancaster, (Standardbreds); Dr. Dan Wilson, Cleveland, (Standardbreds); and Dr. Scott Shell, Cleveland (Thoroughbreds).
All five veterinarians agreed that clients in their respective practices were in favor of out of competition testing in the Buckeye State.
“We need to establish a simple process, whereas a public training center or private farm would be able to be easily licensed by the OSRC,” Dr. Barry Carter stated. “By being licensed, it would allow the OSRC to walk onto a property at any time and test and/or examine any racehorse.
“The race secretaries would only accept horses from licensed facilities,” Dr. Carter added. “And the licensing fees should be nominal, so everyone would be encouraged to get licensed.”
“My major concern is, what will we test for?” said Dr. Dan Wilson. “The RCI protocol is currently burdensome and we need to narrow the focus of testing and test for street designer drugs such as neuro-toxins, blood doping agents and venoms.
“Also, we’ll have to deal with horses coming in from neighboring states such as Michigan and New York. At Northfield (Park), we have a ton of horses coming from these areas every night and have anywhere from 640 to 740 horses stabled on the grounds.”
“Out of competition testing will eliminate the ‘shooting star’ trainers, as well as the gossip and innuendoes that are a backstretch constant,” Dr. John Piehowicz acknowledged. “Out of competition testing also serves as a strong deterrent to those few bad apples we have in the racing industry.
“Racing is a privilege, just like driving, and protocol will need to be set well in advance,” Dr. Piehowicz continued. “We’re going to need to establish who does the testing. What criteria is that person going to have to be authorized to test horses? What about out of state competitors? How do we handle them? We’re going to have to work closely in cooperation with surrounding states.
“The penalties need to be stiff too—ten or 15-year suspensions or a life ban for medications that are injurious to the welfare of the horse,” Dr. Piehowicz stressed. “This year at Belterra Park we had 900 horses on the grounds and 30 to 40 percent of those on race day are ship-ins, so a slap on the wrist for a drug that has no business being in a horse’s system isn’t appropriate.”
“I’m firmly in favor of out of competition testing but the RCI model as it currently stands is just way too large,” said Dr. Scott Shell. “There are drugs out there right now that have no business being in a horse: venoms, toxics and blood-doping agents like synthetic EPO. However, there are a lot of drugs on the RCI list that we use as healing agents and we need to narrow the scope to those harmful agents.
“Out of competition testing will also help to eliminate excess testing expenses,” Dr. Shell continued. “In order for me to keep my veterinarian license, I’m required to be accountable for every drop of medication that goes into every horse and when and where I performed that service. Therefore, a trainer needs to be able to produce a vet record of his or her horses so that regulators have a clear idea of what is therapeutic and what isn’t.
“For instance, anabolic steroids are a controlled substance that we, as veterinarians, use therapeutically, and we need to establish the difference between when medications are used therapeutically and when they are not.”
“Out of competition testing has become a necessity,” Dr. John Reichert admitted. “The majority of trainers are operating within the rules, but because of the few bad apples we need out of competition testing and we need to establish accurate testing. I’m talking about agents that have long term effects on a horse’s system: blood doping, venoms, etc. We need an effective narrow scope of testing, and the accuracy of testing is paramount to establishing severe penalties for the cheaters.
“We also need to think about legal concerns,” Dr. Reichert continued. “For instance, do we do random testing, or do we pick the obvious cheaters? There’s not many trainers who operate on a 400 to 600-win average. But we’re also going to have to think about horses that throw in bad races for reasons such as flipped-palates and tying up, and then dramatically improve when in the hands of a new trainer who can help alleviate those issues.
“I also think that logistically we’ll have to figure out how we’re going to cooperate amongst the other states who already have out of competition testing in place,” Dr. Reichert noted. “For instance, different states have different testing procedures. Are we going to test the horses in the state they’re currently in or do we bring them to a central location? The manpower to do the testing has to be credentialed and capable as well.”
“In my opinion, out of competition testing is the biggest deterrent to illicit drug use in this industry,” Dr. Barry Carter concluded.
“Obviously, out of competition is a multi-faceted issue which needs to be discussed further,” stated Robert Schmitz, OSRC chairman. “At our January 2019 meeting, I’m asking the Ohio Department of Agriculture’s testing lab to be on hand to lend their insight into this issue.”
As the airplane pilot said on the intercom, "We are now entering Ohio airspace. Please set your clocks back 25 years."
New York and California have had OOCT for years. Less than 1% of all samples taken. And less than 1% of those showing any positives. It doesn't hurt, but if you're looking for da shit, this is not the way to go about it. If anything, it lets cocksuckers like Jewffrey, George Maylin and other piece of shit regulators to target the "whisper" cheats. Ohio is just grandstanding. Until next time, sweeties......... ......HEIL HITLER!!
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99% of positive test come from drugs sold by vets why not get rid of them most are scums who will give anything to a horse , their standard answer is if i dont do it someone else will their just greedy money hungry pigs
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As the airplane pilot said on the intercom, "We are now entering Ohio airspace. Please set your clocks back 25 years."
New York and California have had OOCT for years. Less than 1% of all samples taken. And less than 1% of those showing any positives. It doesn't hurt, but if you're looking for da shit, this is not the way to go about it. If anything, it lets cocksuckers like Jewffrey, George Maylin and other piece of shit regulators to target the "whisper" cheats. Ohio is just grandstanding. Until next time, sweeties......... ......HEIL HITLER!!
I don't believe NY has OC Testing, Faraldo made sure of that
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I don't believe NY has OC Testing, Faraldo made sure of that
https://nytha.com/nys-gaming-commission-approves-new-out-of-competition-testing-rule/
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99% of positive test come from drugs sold by vets why not get rid of them most are scums who will give anything to a horse , their standard answer is if i dont do it someone else will their just greedy money hungry pigs
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You are retarded if you think that the vets are using their own drugs in these big stables. They might be used to give it but it will be an unmarked bottle with instructions. The big boys have chemists that are constantly working on the newest shit and how to beat any tests. I laugh at the clowns on here who think the vets are responsible. They get to treat Joe Smo`s horses but I gaurantee you that Allard or Burke isn`t going to the vet for his pre-race!
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Why you guy's continue to care about drugs is a joke? Load em up,have every driver try!! That would be great racing!! There should be NO TESTING!!
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https://nytha.com/nys-gaming-commission-approves-new-out-of-competition-testing-rule/
Thank you Buffy, I live in NY and didn't know this
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China has the best system. Each track has a barn area with actual military trained security guards. Nothing illegal gets in or out. Cameras see EVERYTHING and the vets are owned by the track. They can't practice anywhere but in that barn area. Also, one strike and you are OUT and looking at prison time. No bullshit like here.
Anything will beat the nothing that goes on now. I like the idea of authorized barns. AND, why would OH tracks allow out of state horses that don't adhere to the same rules. That's a loophole that can't be allowed. Also, sort of like the Scarlet Letter. If you are on probation, you have to wear a big 'C' shirt and a dunce cap.
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China has the best system. Each track has a barn area with actual military trained security guards. Nothing illegal gets in or out. Cameras see EVERYTHING and the vets are owned by the track. They can't practice anywhere but in that barn area. Also, one strike and you are OUT and looking at prison time. No bullshit like here.
Hong Kong is not in China.
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Why you guy's continue to care about drugs is a joke? Load em up,have every driver try!! That would be great racing!! There should be NO TESTING!!
You are the biggest retard of all!!!
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Thank you Buffy, I live in NY and didn't know this
Has it been adopted for harness racing, too? Last I checked,no.
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Looks like Buffy is up to date. the latest info from NY Gaming, out of comp. testing is in the harness racing rules; 4120.17 . Does anyone know of a horse that has been tested under this new rule, in NY?
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Every Vet mentioned the problem of 'Venom.' back when I raced, knew of guys who used the snake venom. Not sure what the popular 'venom' is today or what targeted areas it's used for
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Looks like Buffy is up to date. the latest info from NY Gaming, out of comp. testing is in the harness racing rules; 4120.17 . Does anyone know of a horse that has been tested under this new rule, in NY?
yo, yo, The Extorter,
Don't hurt yourself, kid. This is just the latest version. A few years ago Faraldo and Co. lost a case about OOCT where NY could make you bring your horse in from NJ for testing if you were licensed in NY. As my earlier post suggested, they probably haven't tested 50 horses under this rule. Sounds tough, but it gets almost nothing done.
Years ago, guys used to bring in a vet from Florida to do all the snake venom work especially for feet. Does anyone remember the vet's name? Well-known but I can't remember it. Until next time, darlings......... .......HEIL HITLER!!
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Hey, Snuffy. It is my pleasure to tell you to go fuck yourself once again. God I missed that. Anyway, yes I am familiar with earlier attempts to gain OTC testing in New York. As for the venom in the feet in Florida, Georgie Nap had a barn full and won at will anytime he pleased. Then, the horses were so far gone and sold for salvage.
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yo, yo, The Extorter,
Don't hurt yourself, kid. This is just the latest version. A few years ago Faraldo and Co. lost a case about OOCT where NY could make you bring your horse in from NJ for testing if you were licensed in NY. As my earlier post suggested, they probably haven't tested 50 horses under this rule. Sounds tough, but it gets almost nothing done.
Years ago, guys used to bring in a vet from Florida to do all the snake venom work especially for feet. Does anyone remember the vet's name? Well-known but I can't remember it. Until next time, darlings......... .......HEIL HITLER!!
I'm guessing the tests are listed somewhere or do we need Pigland to go to Albany and do a FOIL
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As the airplane pilot said on the intercom, "We are now entering Ohio airspace. Please set your clocks back 25 years."
New York and California have had OOCT for years. Less than 1% of all samples taken. And less than 1% of those showing any positives. It doesn't hurt, but if you're looking for da shit, this is not the way to go about it. If anything, it lets cocksuckers like Jewffrey, George Maylin and other piece of shit regulators to target the "whisper" cheats. Ohio is just grandstanding. Until next time, sweeties......... ......HEIL HITLER!!
True as true can be !! It goes way beyond testing. Ohio Racing Comm is a do nothing, absolutely nothing state sponsored insider game. They did nothing earlier this year w/ the herpes virus scare to block other states entry. NOW, they cling to the dumbass 30 / 60 day rules re: claiming. Many, many of the trainers in Ohio race at N'Fld and the 3 SW track. What the hell is the purpose of that 30 day racing rule. Indiana has abandoned the stupid concept, OH should too. AND, speaking of Indiana,- Hoosier closes so the IN trainers start entering in OH and suddenly, the OH preferred rule is out the window. This cumbersome bureaucracy w/ no oversight is worse than Washington DC. The horse racing is residual to all the over regulated stipulations.
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Hey, Snuffy. It is my pleasure to tell you to go fuck yourself once again. God I missed that. Anyway, yes I am familiar with earlier attempts to gain OTC testing in New York. As for the venom in the feet in Florida, Georgie Nap had a barn full and won at will anytime he pleased. Then, the horses were so far gone and sold for salvage.
yo, yo, The Extorter,
You have been a long time Hitler Youth to your credit. But with that comes the fact that you are as stupid as they all are although I rank you a bit above those complete asswipes like Hammer Head, Lice Man, Shoulda Retried and Stunned Forever. Here's the thing: you know about 1% of what you think you know, you dick fuck. Shut the fuck up and keep your comments to a bare minimum. Out of competition testing will do nothing to change the landscape of this industry.
And...........I have not seen the contract but I think that Phat Phuck Phord the Phallacious Phraud is lying about the new contract with Jewffrey. It says a bit of ever dollar bet at Fan Stool Janitor Closet goes to purses. I think that's a lie. Until next time, meatheads........ ..HEIL HITLER!!
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I'm guessing the tests are listed somewhere or do we need Pigland to go to Albany and do a FOIL
Yonk', it is on the NYS Gaming Commission website.
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Looks like Buffy is up to date. the latest info from NY Gaming, out of comp. testing is in the harness racing rules; 4120.17 . Does anyone know of a horse that has been tested under this new rule, in NY?
They drew blood from a lot of horses before the NYSS finals. Now, whether or not they ran any tests is another question....
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As long as they are not testing the buckeye linemen for steroids and the skill personal for ped's… Bring it on!
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As long as they are not testing the buckeye linemen for steroids and the skill personal for ped's… Bring it on!
Good reason for your suspicions too, Parked. It was not too long ago NY adopted the no steroid policy. Then never tested for steroids for years.
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Ron Adams got nailed with EPO at Mohawk
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If Ohio did indeed eliminate epo (including sent hectic) and all types of pain killing venoms there would not be ONE +.400 trainer in Ohio. IMO Every one of them that's over that percentage currently is using one or the other or both. No reason not too as it can't be detected in Ohio right now.
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To Buffy The Vampire Slayer
the vet from FL, that used snake venom on feet, was Dr Arthur Nestvedt--he also owned horses in Delaware, etc. I know of one horse he injected many years ago & the foot fell off. He had some radical vet ideas. Saw him a year or so ago--a few years ago, he had horses with Rick Zeron. Dr Nestvedt lives in Casselberry, FL--he's around 85....
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To Buffy The Vampire Slayer
the vet from FL, that used snake venom on feet, was Dr Arthur Nestvedt--he also owned horses in Delaware, etc. I know of one horse he injected many years ago & the foot fell off. He had some radical vet ideas. Saw him a year or so ago--a few years ago, he had horses with Rick Zeron. Dr Nestvedt lives in Casselberry, FL--he's around 85....
yo, yo, Bob Dylan,
Bingo! That's him. Had quite a reputation but did nothing for the couple of mine he worked on. I had one lame in the ass end. He wanted to go into some joint deep in the ass. He pulled out a needle that was about 2 feet long and wrapped in a circle like a scythe. He did a million feet. Venom.
Thank you for the good catch. Well done. Songwriters are sharp. Much sharper than, say, The Extorter, who believes that OOCT will save the game. Idiot. Thanx again, Bob. Until next time, sweeties......... .....HEIL HITLER!!
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To Buffy The Vampire Slayer
the vet from FL, that used snake venom on feet, was Dr Arthur Nestvedt--he also owned horses in Delaware, etc. I know of one horse he injected many years ago & the foot fell off. He had some radical vet ideas. Saw him a year or so ago--a few years ago, he had horses with Rick Zeron. Dr Nestvedt lives in Casselberry, FL--he's around 85....
It's not snake venom that is being used now. It's a much more potent venom that does not come from snakes
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Really guys its O. H. I. O.. the most backwards inbred pennciltuckians around. The thought of OOCT fixing anything is MORONIC....