HORSEPLOP.COM
General Category => Harness Racing => Topic started by: NJ Observer on September 14, 2023, 09:47:07 AM
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GIMME YOUR 4.
J CAMPBELL
H FILION
M LACHANCE
CATMAN
ALL 4 WONS LOTS OF IMPORTANT RACES!!! CAN'T PUT A COKEHEAD LIKE CASE IN THERE OR A PALONE TYPE BECAUSE HE DIDN'T DRIVE MUCH AT THE SWAMP!!!
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Billy Haughton
Stanley Dancer
Brian Sears
John Campbell
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John Campbell
Brian Sears
Aarron Merriman
Herve Fillion
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In order, left to right as you are facing it.....
John Campbell
Herve Filion
William Haughton
Stanley Dancer
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Herve
Campbell
Case
??
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Haughton
Dancer
Campbell
Del Miller (not that he was the most prolific as a driver but regal and deserves the honor)
Most of the others were cheats, addicts, drunks, abusers etc so they don't deserve to be on a monument
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Haughton
Dancer
Campbell
Del Miller (not that he was the most prolific as a driver but regal and deserves the honor)
Most of the others were cheats, addicts, drunks, abusers etc so they don't deserve to be on a monument
I get the whole del miller thing but then what do you do with herve since it is a drivers Rushmore
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I know about the driving thing which is why I put a disclaimer but to me a Mount Rushmore is a regal American thing. He can be on a Canadian one with his brothers and nephew. ngc3
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I know about the driving thing which is why I put a disclaimer but to me a Mount Rushmore is a regal American thing. He can be on a Canadian one with his brothers and nephew. ngc3
Works for me, my friend
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I have a few opinions on what I have read here so far. I wouldn’t put Merriman on the mountain because he hasn’t succeeded in the sport’s biggest moments. He should have his own statue for his endurance alone adding to what he has accomplished in recent years is . I left Herve out by a hair. Whether he was truly guilty or not, I cannot include him due to his long absence after being removed from competition. As far a Cat Manzi I would compare him to retired NY Yankee Bernie Williams. Bernie was a clutch player, has 4 WS rings but just comes up a little short for the HOF based on his stats. Finally regarding the existing Mt Rushmore I would take out Teddy Roosevelt and have John Campbell replace him. Teddy was quite a character and did some excellent things as President but he wasn’t George Washington, Thomas Jefferson or Abe Lincoln. Campbell was the greatest driver who ever set foot on a racetrack in my opinion. He would represent the sport of harness racing like no one else. Who do I contact to make this happen? 73cv.2
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Haughton
Dancer
Herve
O'Brien
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Keith Waples
John Campbell
Herve Filion
Billy Odonnell
Tim Tetrick
honorable mention--Sears
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Rene Poulin don’t forget the chisel in a 💩 next to his face!
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as of today,
Haughton
Dancer
Campbell
Dave Miller
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I have a few opinions on what I have read here so far. I wouldn’t put Merriman on the mountain because he hasn’t succeeded in the sport’s biggest moments. He should have his own statue for his endurance alone adding to what he has accomplished in recent years is . I left Herve out by a hair. Whether he was truly guilty or not, I cannot include him due to his long absence after being removed from competition. As far a Cat Manzi I would compare him to retired NY Yankee Bernie Williams. Bernie was a clutch player, has 4 WS rings but just comes up a little short for the HOF based on his stats. Finally regarding the existing Mt Rushmore I would take out Teddy Roosevelt and have John Campbell replace him. Teddy was quite a character and did some excellent things as President but he wasn’t George Washington, Thomas Jefferson or Abe Lincoln. Campbell was the greatest driver who ever set foot on a racetrack in my opinion. He would represent the sport of harness racing like no one else. Who do I contact to make this happen? 73cv.2
Certainly not the Alzheimers victim at 1600 Penn. ave.
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Certainly not the Alzheimers victim at 1600 Penn. ave.
Don’t forget his tutor and mentor , the token shine!
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How about at each track, past and present even if the track no longer exists?
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top Canadians........ .....
John Campbell
Keith Waples
Bud Fritz
Charlie Lawson
Not on Rushmore but the Niagara Escarpment
OK, Herve wasn't a real Canadian
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Certainly not the Alzheimers victim at 1600 Penn. ave.
thx for derailing another topic. When you're launched far from here, go suck off that bloated orange loser you adore!
I'll lay you 5/1 on $1,000 that the 3 years older current POTUS would mop the floor with TFG in a mental acuity test 8x in 10.
Now, back on topic:
Campbell
Manzi
Palone
LaChance
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It never ceases to amaze me how certain people’s entire mind is dominated by today’s political atmosphere. Here we have a fun conversation where we all learn things harness racing only to be interrupted by a racist piece of garbage who can’t possibly stay on point. Why these Ploppers don’t hang out on Fox News, CNN etc instead of crapping out their moronic commentary just pisses me off.
Don’t forget his tutor and mentor , the token shine!
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thx for derailing another topic. When you're launched far from here, go suck off that bloated orange loser you adore!
I'll lay you 5/1 on $1,000 that the 3 years older current POTUS would mop the floor with TFG in a mental acuity test 8x in 10.
Now, back on topic:
Campbell
Manzi
Palone
LaChance
are you fucking serious this POS can’t put a fucking sentence together along with his fucking cackling idiot puppet! Look at gas prices in flation you fucking idiot!
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It never ceases to amaze me how certain people’s entire mind is dominated by today’s political atmosphere. Here we have a fun conversation where we all learn things harness racing only to be interrupted by a racist piece of garbage who can’t possibly stay on point. Why these Ploppers don’t hang out on Fox News, CNN etc instead of crapping out their moronic commentary just pisses me off.
Didnt mean to upset you Theo my friend. I thought your question about who to contact was asked in jest, so i answered with a lame joke since it had some peripheral connection to the federal govt and national parks.
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are you fucking serious this POS can’t put a fucking sentence together along with his fucking cackling idiot puppet! Look at gas prices in flation you fucking idiot!
ngc3 ngc3 ngc3 Gaadzoots Gaagoots!
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Didnt mean to upset you Theo my friend. I thought your question about who to contact was asked in jest, so i answered with a lame joke since it had some peripheral connection to the federal govt and national parks.
All is cool
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tmbz1TY
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I nominate that 1980 hot Meadowlands piss catcher with short blonde hair! She swallowed every drop and got the balls and everything!
It was a shame she lasted two weeks before we got busted fucking in the piss stall by Barbara the state vet who I was also making small talk with trying to fuck.
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I nominate that 1980 hot Meadowlands piss catcher with short blonde hair! She swallowed every drop and got the balls and everything!
It was a shame she lasted two weeks before we got busted fucking in the piss stall by Barbara the state vet who I was also making small talk with trying to fuck.
ooooooook
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I nominate that 1980 hot Meadowlands piss catcher with short blonde hair! She swallowed every drop and got the balls and everything!
It was a shame she lasted two weeks before we got busted fucking in the piss stall by Barbara the state vet who I was also making small talk with trying to fuck.
Good grief. Is it possible to get a few more graphic details? ngc3
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JC
Ron Pierce
David Miller
Have a fan vote for the next guy...
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JC
Ron Pierce
David Miller
Have a fan vote for the next guy...
Pearce is a good choice.
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Good grief. Is it possible to get a few more graphic details? ngc3
lol I have more details if you need them! 😂😂
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Billy Haughton
Herve
Ron Pierce
Tim Tetrick
Honorable mention -- Peter Haughton
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Campbell
Hennessey
Lachance
Herve
(all based on skill over a long period of time.) Tetrick waiting in the wings if his hips hold up 10 more years.
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Years ago Hollywood Heyden asked some of the Meadowlands drivers colony who were the top five drivers of all time. This is what they said
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BD6ycHYXwUo
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Campbell, LaChance, Case, Purple Jesus
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I rank them on how calm they were when under the gun in the biggest races.
Campbell -no one close when the most was on the line.
Pierce- never carried a bad race from one drive to the next big drive.
LaChance - his confidence was his best attribute when the money was on the line.
DMiller - clam n cool regardless if he had a fav or not when the money was on the line.
Herve- he was just unshakable for over 3 Decades.
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I will repeat..
Left to right..
Campbell, Herve, Haughton, Dancer
They are the bedrock, foundational
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I will repeat..
Left to right..
Campbell, Herve, Haughton, Dancer
They are the bedrock, foundational
I agree. But I just smoked a fat one. ngc3
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I agree. But I just smoked a fat one. ngc3
ngc3 ngc3 ngc3 The sticky icky....
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Campbell
Goudreau
K Waples
Miller
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Herve
Campbell
LaChance
Gilmour
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Herve Lachance Campbell Pierce
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Herve
Campbell
LaChance
Gilmour
tmbz1
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Russell Rash......Andrew Kelson.......Davi d Dunkley.......Mer it Dokey. Andrew Bruce Kelson, (80) of Franklin, Massachusetts, passed away on June 26, 2023, after a 6-year private battle with cancer. Andy was born to Samuel and Dorothy Kelson, on April 10, 1943, in Bronx, NY. After graduating from Pace University in New York City, he went into harness horse racing and was an owner, trainer, and driver at Foxboro Raceway. After retiring from racing, he and his wife, Claire, opened up Franklin Lighting Center in Franklin, MA which they successfully ran for almost 30 years. It was eventually taken over by their long-time employee and friend, David Simpson.
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David Dunckley was a nice guy, who tried hard and meant well and died very young leaving behind a family without much. Mean to mock his memory on here.
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John...All time...last 25 yrs. Brian.....as far as Herve I think very over rated.....Def not greatest of all time or second to JC..
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John...All time...last 25 yrs. Brian.....as far as Herve I think very over rated.....Def not greatest of all time or second to JC..
Thats a classic line- Herve Filion "very overrated" - maybe the greatest set of hands God gifted a man. From testimonials of others, his achievements, win total in THAT era, praise from colleagues and my own personal experience with a man i considered the greatest and a friend, I will tell you plainly he was not overrated. In fact he was God in the sulky. Just ask some of the plugs he drove.
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That's your opinion...mine is mine .I have been around this game as long as you in many capacity...my opinion is valid as yours us to you
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Trevor Ritchie had ice in his veins and came up big many times in Grand Circuit races from limited opportunities.
If it wasn't for a nasty spill that put his back out good that he began only driving trotters exclusively, he was one of the best in the bike. He didn't drive the volume that the big guns do today but % wise he ranks up with the best.
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Of course, your opinion is valid. i respect that. But calling Herve overrated is silly. Who's next ? Gretzky, Mantle, Jordan, Jim Brown, Ali, Secretariat? Comeon, man! I remain, your friend, F
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I'm surely not alone in my view....plus if Hank played in ny and micky in Milwaukee and Atlanta they would be saying mickey who
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Yeah, Carmine would agree with you...right after he snuck into Herve's locker and stole his whip and gloves.
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John was a modern version of the chief...just 25 xs better
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When you included Herve, i thought you were kidding around or trying to get me riled up ( see avatar ) plus i recently made a post that everyone loved called "Second master". Turns out you were serious, so I will say cordially and in closing on the subject. I can honestly say that in my 50 years in the game, I have heard all kinds of things said about Herve from many different corners, but never, ever before today have I heard him called "overrated", not even by some OTB loser whose money Herve just ran over. but, I respect your feelings.
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John Campbell
Herve Filion
David Miller
Brian Sears
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IO like and respect your list a lot! I went with Haughton and Dancer after JC and Herve, because i consider them foundational cornerstones of the sport, as in Washington and Jefferson were to the country.
Sears at his pinnacle was a classic driver, no doubt.
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Russell Rash......
Actually, Russell teamed one of my horses who was a flat-out puller. He would have given Virgil Morgan a run for the strongest arms in the paddock, and was the only one who could really rate that horse.
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Actually, Russell teamed one of my horses who was a flat-out puller. He would have given Virgil Morgan a run for the strongest arms in the paddock, and was the only one who could really rate that horse.
He sure was a big man!!
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John Campbell
Herve Filion
David Miller
Brian Sears
If you can put Herve up there, you can put Walter Case Jr. up there too! They both had their share of legal issues too!
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Herve Filion and Walter Case Jr. were diametric opposite human beings, drivers and horsemen.
I don't seem to remember Herve trying to kill Barbara'
I don't seem to remember Herve addicted to drugs.
I don't seem to remember Herve kicking and slashing and driving with 1 foot out of the stirrup.
Herve drove and won for me. I wouldn't let Walter near a horse of mine if he had 50,000 wins.
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But I seem to remember Walter tried to win every race he was. I remember that was not Herves goal..don't forget to include that stat
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But I seem to remember Walter tried to win every race he was. I remember that was not Herve's goal..don't forget to include that stat
Yet Herve won almost 5000 moreand it took guys like Morgan, Palone and Cat almost a decade to pass him for the wins lead while Herve was shutdown.
I respect your opinion but you can have 40 starts with Walter and I will have 40 starts with Herve, same horse, I believe I will do better.
I know at least, I will get the 40 starts. Sonny Patterson once said to me watching him drive. "If Herve goes to the whip, it's because his hands hurt" Something to that effect.
One other note. Admittedly both are iconic first name drivers. When you say Walter it conjures up a certain image and style, when you say Herve it conjures up a totally different image and style. I like mine more.
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It depends what you want with your forty. Starts.....I will say you might get all 40 starts with Herve but will never make more money as an owner with him driving...plus he was never a gamblers friend likee wally was... I want to win as an owner or player...yes you can pay the bills 3rd 4th ..not for me... race those horses....
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But I seem to remember Walter tried to win every race he was. I remember that was not Herves goal..don't forget to include that stat
That’s what drivers are supposed to do. The last thing you want as an owner is a no-try [or a non-winning attempt] on your horse (especially if you got a good draw)!!
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It depends what you want with your forty. Starts.....I will say you might get all 40 starts with Herve but will never make more money as an owner with him driving...plus he was never a gamblers friend likee wally was... I want to win as an owner or player...yes you can pay the bills 3rd 4th ..not for me... race those horses....
Herve in his prime was the best driver on a half mile track to ever sit in a sulky.
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Hands down. He was God. If I say it, they argue with me.
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Walter also had some "advantages" Herve, quite honestly did not. Walter arrived in the era of the tube and Epogen, He also, had that clangy single hitch lift bike. Walter got first call from all of the cheaters, gassers and tubers of the day, especially Joe Guarino. Throw in Lapoff, Marino, Flis, Brennan, and on and on. Didn't he and Gaurino team up to set the all time YR wins mark ( upper 200s ) beating Larry Summer and Perry Steinkohl's record? On top of everything else he was doing, Guarino apparently had a mole in the Cornell testing trailer and would find out what they were testing for on a given night. Apparently he even treated horses on the old backtrack behind the paddock. All this until they caught up with him for good. Of course, Herve drove pre-raced horses, but he kicked ass night after night when there were Hall of Famers from end to end across the starting gate. For those of you who consider Carmine great, consider Herve had twice as many career wins. Twice as many. Herve sometimes wanted to be 3rd and 4th no doubt. I knew him well. But, for someone who cheated a lot, he won a shitload!
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Herve in his prime was the best driver on a half mile track to ever sit in a sulky.
Just dont agree with me too often, Mike. It will be bad for your image. Remember, I am just "coffee grinds". 73cv.2
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Just dont agree with me too often, Mike. It will be bad for your image. Remember, I am just "coffee grinds". 73cv.2
LOL
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;D
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Walter also had some "advantages" Herve, quite honestly did not. Walter arrived in the era of the tube and Epogen, He also, had that clangy single hitch lift bike. Walter got first call from all of the cheaters, gassers and tubers of the day, especially Joe Guarino. Throw in Lapoff, Marino, Flis, Brennan, and on and on. Didn't he and Gaurino team up to set the all time YR wins mark ( upper 200s ) beating Larry Summer and Perry Steinkohl's record? On top of everything else he was doing, Guarino apparently had a mole in the Cornell testing trailer and would find out what they were testing for on a given night. Apparently he even treated horses on the old backtrack behind the paddock. All this until they caught up with him for good. Of course, Herve drove pre-raced horses, but he kicked ass night after night when there were Hall of Famers from end to end across the starting gate. For those of you who consider Carmine great, consider Herve had twice as many career wins. Twice as many. Herve sometimes wanted to be 3rd and 4th no doubt. I knew him well. But, for someone who cheated a lot, he won a shitload!
Maybe back before 'tubes and epogen', trainers were doing things that weren't 100% legal too! Nobody can confirm or deny this! FYI, look who Case raced against at Northfield during his stay there! Look at that driving colony then and what they accomplished!over the years!
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Of course trainersw were. there has always been pre-racing and drugging. But the tube/milkshake ( thanks to Dr. Grasso ) at least at YR and RR and Epogen turned the sport on its ear, turned a majority of the horses into "chemical creations", pushed the clean guys and little guys to the curb and the sport has never truly recovered or been the same since.
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Herve in his prime was the best driver on a half mile track to ever sit in a sulky.
......and John Campbell was not. Campbell and the great "Always Be Miki", saw the George Washington Bridge as a toxic barricade. When the money, I mean the REAL MONEY, was down at Roosevelt, Eddie Cobb, always got it done. Secondly, most you talk of overnighters, because in reality, most of you aren't Horsemen, you are sad gamblers. How does Aaron Merriman even get into this conservation (250,000 drives per year, 150,000 wins) on a Bull Ring. The great drivers drove and drive the Grand Circuit. Start your picks there. As far as " First Over" Herve was concerned, he had Maurice Pusey who made Capitol Hills Farm what it was, while he lost thousands more than he made in A.C. or playing gin in the Roosevelt track kitchen. By the way, night after night, in his their natural environment, I think that Campbell and Pierce were probanbly the best, and that is the reason I never used either.
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Walter Case Jr is an all-time great....on Horseplop. ngc3 ngc3 ngc3
Shouldn't be mentioned in the same breath as the true greats.
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......and John Campbell was not. Campbell and the great "Always Be Miki", saw the George Washington Bridge as a toxic barricade. When the money, I mean the REAL MONEY, was down at Roosevelt, Eddie Cobb, always got it done. Secondly, most you talk of overnighters, because in reality, most of you aren't Horsemen, you are sad gamblers. How does Aaron Merriman even get into this conservation (250,000 drives per year, 150,000 wins) on a Bull Ring. The great drivers drove and drive the Grand Circuit. Start your picks there. As far as " First Over" Herve was concerned, he had Maurice Pusey who made Capitol Hills Farm what it was, while he lost
thousands more than he made in A.C. or playing gin in the Roosevelt track kitchen. By the way, night after night, in his their natural environment, I think that Campbell and Pierce were probanbly the best, and that is the reason I never used either.
FYI John Campbell after winning leading driver for the second straight year at the Meadowlands went to Roosevelt and broke the record for the most wins for the fall meet. Fact. Look it up.
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Well if you ask Greg Peck he should be there as the greatest Trainer/ Driver.
then there is the real greats...
Calloway
Cardinal
Kerington
Haughton
Campbell
Filion
Merriman (by accomplishments alone).
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Well if you ask Greg Peck he should be there as the greatest Trainer/ Driver.
then there is the real greats...
Calloway
Cardinal
Kerington
Haughton
Campbell
Filion
Merriman (by accomplishments alone).
I never saw Calloway, Cardinal or Kerington drive so I can't agree or disagree. Campbell and Filion for sure. If you are putting Merriman in by accomplisment alone, I think Dave Palone should be ahead of him.
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I never saw Calloway, Cardinal or Kerington drive so I can't agree or disagree. Campbell and Filion for sure. If you are putting Merriman in by accomplisment alone, I think Dave Palone should be ahead of him.
Makes sense. I would agree on that as well.
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Makes sense. I would agree on that as well.
Well then perhaps Dickie Stilings shoud be mentioned. I sent Dickie some nice claimers who got over the tartan surface quite well. I think Dickie drove well enough to stick with Dave Palone, after all he won two jugs, back to back I think for Royal Travel with the Spur horses. Horses I sent him were for enhancing my bank account. They werecheap claimers racing against cheaper claimers
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Chicago Mt Rushmore
1- Tony Morgan
2- Joe Marsh Jr
3- Walter Paisley
4- Daryl Busse
Honorable mention Dave Magee and Gene Vallandingham
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Well then perhaps Dickie Stilings shoud be mentioned. I sent Dickie some nice claimers who got over the tartan surface quite well. I think Dickie drove well enough to stick with Dave Palone, after all he won two jugs, back to back I think for Royal Travel with the Spur horses. Horses I sent him were for enhancing my bank account. They werecheap claimers racing against cheaper claimers
Dave Palone has won 20,000 races. Once again, 20,000.
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True. But about 150 of them were East of Scranton. I was there when he tried a couple whacks at the Big M mid 80s. Campbell, O'donnell, Moiseyev, et al sent him back to farm country quick. Still 20,000 in 40 years is a major accomplishment! Great durability and consistency
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True. But about 150 of them were East of Scranton. I was there when he tried a couple whacks at the Big M mid 80s. Campbell, O'donnell, Moiseyev, et al sent him back to farm country quick. Still 20,000 in 40 years is a major accomplishment! Great durability and consistency
Very true but he was comparing him to Dick Stillings. He was a decent driver and a real good trainer but Dave Palone has won 20,000 races.
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Gotcha. That's like comparing ME to Brad Pitt in the looks department.
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Gotcha. That's like comparing ME to Brad Pitt in the looks department.
LOL
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Chicago Mt Rushmore
1- Tony Morgan
2- Joe Marsh Jr
3- Walter Paisley
4- Daryl Busse
Honorable mention Dave Magee and Gene Vallandingham
I never quite got on the Morgan bandwagon. I used to love betting Balmoral and made nice profits going with Oostings over Morgan. Had the same luck with Sears over Palone at the Meadows. They would both strategically nail the bigshot at the finish.
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For tony Morgan to be second all time in wins with way over 17,000 and not be in the HOF because of a long standing bias out of Columbus due to his feuds with Bergstein and Pines is fucking BS and an embarassment. How do we as an industry not recognize a guy with that kind of win total with enshrinement? Makes a mockery of the whole thing!
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For tony Morgan to be second all time in wins with way over 17,000 and not be in the HOF because of a long standing bias out of Columbus due to his feuds with Bergstein and Pines is fucking BS and an embarassment. How do we as an industry not recognize a guy with that kind of win total with enshrinement? Makes a mockery of the whole thing!
Hard to deny a man with 17,000+ wins. Does anyone know what his biggest win was?
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Jugette, Woodrow Wilson, US Pacing Championship with Ball And Chain among others according to bio. I remember the Ball and Chain win.
Was just checking his bio First driver in history to reach 850 win plateau with 853. Walter got 843 the year before.
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Jugette, Woodrow Wilson, US Pacing Championship with Ball And Chain among others according to bio. I remember the Ball and Chain win.
Was just checking his bio First driver in history to reach 850 win plateau with 853. Walter got 843 the year before.
No triple crown wins may be an issue.
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Very true but he was comparing him to Dick Stillings. He was a decent driver and a real good trainer but Dave Palone has won 20,000 races.
Actually, John Salvi trained most of Dick's stuff. I sent him horses that were just better. I like most everything you post. Palone was almost always an overlay, Stilling was always an underlay. I like that. That is the reason I never used Palone at the Meadows for instance. It wasn't a comparison of the two. The best are the best because they always get the best.
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FYI John Campbell after winning leading driver for the second straight year at the Meadowlands went to Roosevelt and broke the record for the most wins for the fall meet. Fact. Look it up.
Com'on Mike, get serious.
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Com'on Mike, get serious.
Mike is right. Campbell always came over for the fall meet. it was like 78 or 79, I think and Campbell kicked ass. Plus he would always come over for major stuff on Saturday nights. Not only him early days but Webster , Gagliardi, Lew Williams, Billy O, Remmen, webster Meadowlands 7 pm post, YR/RR 8pm as you know, they would drive 4 or 5 races, then chopper over and be there for the majors in NY by 9 pm. It used to land behind the backstretch. Spooked hell out of horses in the dungeon paddock at YR as it descended. I recall one got loose it was so scared, ran around the paddock a bit until someone grabbed a hold.
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8pm post meadowlands....as Jack Webb Sargeant Joe Friday would say....
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Mike is right. Campbell always came over for the fall meet. it was like 78 or 79, I think and Campbell kicked ass. Plus he would always come over for major stuff on Saturday nights. Not only him early days but Webster , Gagliardi, Lew Williams, Billy O, Remmen, webster Meadowlands 7 pm post, YR/RR 8pm as you know, they would drive 4 or 5 races, then chopper over and be there for the majors in NY by 9 pm. It used to land behind the backstretch. Spooked hell out of horses in the dungeon paddock at YR as it descended. I recall one got loose it was so scared, ran around the paddock a bit until someone grabbed a hold.
You know, John Campbell may very well be the best, or Herve, or Joe Blow, or Billy Haughton. I didn't go to the races to watch or bet 3/5's. I certainly don't disagree with the popular choices and some here who choices I find well founded. To me it was a business. In the earlier days, I loved 5k claimers with anybody you can name because I always had a $7,500 in with Frankie Tags for instance at 7 or 8 to 1 and really didn't give a shit who I was in against. In the early days, I trained my horses to a jog cart within 2 seconds of where the race would go. So Campbell or Yahotti didn't bother me. Also, if I lost, there was always tomorrow as Eddie Cobb would say. I"m not trying to be arrogant, and I truly think that some here really know their shit, no doubt about it. Hi Sam R!
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8pm post meadowlands....as Jack Webb Sargeant Joe Friday would say....
Back in the day, didn't it start earlier. at 7? Late 70s. Maybe I am wrong
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Back in the day, didn't it start earlier. at 7? Late 70s. Maybe I am wrong
Frankie was a Long Island person from the get-go (went to high school in Farmingdale!) He drove some nice horses and I remember vividly a win with Fulla Napoleon (a really "bullish", almost FFA horse that "dead-eye" Dick Thomas had!) I remember it vividly because it led to a $300+ exacta I had on the race.
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Was Fulla Napoleon ever considered a good sire? I had a couple of young ones that were difficult to get going. Bad attitudes, kinda lug headed. We didn't get along well. Sold both for small money up in new England eventually.
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Was Fulla Napoleon ever considered a good sire? I had a couple of young ones that were difficult to get going. Bad attitudes, kinda lug headed. We didn't get along well. Sold both for small money up in new England eventually.
During the 70's and early 80's my head (with respect to pedigree and breeding) was into trotters, rather than pacers, so I can tell you all about Speedy Crown, Dream of Glory, Royal Prestige, Florida Pro etc., but, quite frankly I don't remember if Fulla Napoleon ever had any top horses??
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ty
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You know, John Campbell may very well be the best, or Herve, or Joe Blow, or Billy Haughton. I didn't go to the races to watch or bet 3/5's. I certainly don't disagree with the popular choices and some here who choices I find well founded. To me it was a business. In the earlier days, I loved 5k claimers with anybody you can name because I always had a $7,500 in with Frankie Tags for instance at 7 or 8 to 1 and really didn't give a shit who I was in against. In the early days, I trained my horses to a jog cart within 2 seconds of where the race would go. So Campbell or Yahotti didn't bother me. Also, if I lost, there was always tomorrow as Eddie Cobb would say. I"m not trying to be arrogant, and I truly think that some here really know their shit, no doubt about it. Hi Sam R!
Sam R knows all the good and bad about NY harness racing in the 1970's and 1980's. Freehold , too.
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Sam R knows all the good and bad about NY harness racing in the 1970's and 1980's. Freehold , too.
Am I the only person who remembers the Meadowlands starting earlier than YR?RR back in the day? Like 7 or 7:30? Can you confirm or refute this. Hope my memory isn't this bad or it's time for hospice. You are very knowledgeable about a lot on here.
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Am I the only person who remembers the Meadowlands starting earlier than YR?RR back in the day? Like 7 or 7:30? Can you confirm or refute this. Hope my memory isn't this bad or it's time for hospice. You are very knowledgeable about a lot on here.
actually they used to start at 6:55PM
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Was Fulla Napoleon ever considered a good sire? I had a couple of young ones that were difficult to get going. Bad attitudes, kinda lug headed. We didn't get along well. Sold both for small money up in new England eventually.
Golden Fulla was about the best one that I can think of.
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actually they used to start at 6:55PM
So it was basically 7. Glad i haven't lost it completely. Do you recall which era?